I know that the title is ominous but I just want to know how to deal with critics and questions about my boxes. I really appreciate the pointed question about a gapping hole that I left by accident in the clue page ....but lately here I recieved notes asking for me to change my clue to make it easier and excuse me but ....bite it! I worked hard to make it a bit off center so as to make it worth hunting but not impossible the info is there it is just not spoon fed.....so far my responses have been nice and quick....but it makes me think after a couple that maybe I should go back and check the stupid thing and change something.
I have a clue from Tdyans (whose hunts I love) that I have been working on and killing myself with for awhile but I would never assume the flaw was hers and not mine....I am the mentally challenged NOT her!!! She worked hard on a fabulous clue and even though it is driving me crazy I still love the challenge of it and I am still working it.

So what are my responses supposed to be ....polite and no info....short and sweet ...and what about the critics who think your wording is wrong.....whatever! Plant what you plant and hunt what you hunt and leave the rest ....right??? This is so fun I can't really see finding reason to be a critic ....if I don't like a plant I skip it and go to the next one....rihgt???

Totally planting with confidence and hunting with a brainache....: )
teekasue

If people are finding the box, I would ignore editorial comments unless you agree with them. I've also deliberately created ambiguities in some of my clues to encourage people to experience more than one corner of a park.

I agree. Some time ago we heard the phrase, "Not all boxes are for all people." Maybe some critics have trouble accepting this aspect. I wouldn't worry about it.

We totally agree on the "Not all boxes are for everybody" concept. In instances where people have requested clues to be easier or whatever, I politely remind requesters of that. If they appear to fresh to the game, I do suggest some easier boxes specifically designed for Family Fun. Usually, that results in happy new people, if they choose to make the effort. If they are seasoned boxers just looking for a free and easy ride, I do not suggest a nearby easy box.

Have a joyous Holiday season,

LB

It doesn't even have to be clues that are designed to be a little bit challenging. I have a box that is very explicit in it's directions. "Stand with the bridge on your right..." That kind of thing. About half the people that look for it find it because they do exactly what the clue says. The other half email me that the clue must be wrong, or it's missing....and you find out that the bridge wasn't on their right, but still ahead of them and so they were looking in the wrong area.

If you know the box is there and it has been found by even one person, I'd say, Leave the clue the way it is!
S

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I know that the title is ominous but I just want to know how to deal with critics and questions about my boxes. I really appreciate the pointed question about a gapping hole that I left by accident in the clue page ....but lately here I recieved notes asking for me to change my clue to make it easier and excuse me but ....bite it!

As a general rule, when someone sends me an e-mail asking for more info, I don't even reply. I'd just as soon they not even know for certain that I got the e-mail.

I don't ignore the messages, though. I read them carefully and review my clues to see if I made some incredible gaff, some glaring mistake that will have them not knowing where to look, or worse, looking in the wrong place 200 miles away!

Who woulda thunk that there are two rivers with the same name in Florida? And, yes, I checked to see if there was more than one Little Porter Lake -- there were a half dozen Porter Lakes, but only one Little Porter Lake -- but then come to find out that MapQuest has incorrectly labelled one of the Porter Lakes as Little Porter Lake and left the real Little Porter Lake unlabelled. It's enough to make a preacher cuss!

You now are learning what it's like to be an artist. An artist gives of themselves...often with little or no renumeration, but just because the love of creating something is so strong. Then they tentatively share it with friends and loved ones, and if they have enough courage...the world.

Because they give of themselves with their valuable time and thought and money, it is sometimes hard to take criticism. Luckily, it is THEIR creation and they have complete freedom to make it anything they wish. An artist has to grow a thick skin, as non-artists will always find something they don't like. Never mind the naysayers..go on with what drives you to create. I guarantee that one appreciate finder will make up for 10 who are so-so about it.

Basically, this is why Ryan and I seem to clash on here. I rightly want control over my letterboxes, and he rightly wants control over his website. Everything is fine, until I feel he is exerting control over my realm, or he feels I am exerting control over his. Please do not take our clashes as anything more than each of us standing up for our own creations. He's a good egg. :) And luckily we both are adults and don't listen to others trying to push their way into our discussions. We have thick skins enough to take all the arrows thrown our way. And in time, you will too. Welcome to the wonderful world of letterboxing! You will meet the most interesting and wonderful friends here. 100 friends for every grump is pretty damn good odds in my book..and worth fighting for. :)

LW PhD
"Nice Counts"

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It doesn't even have to be clues that are designed to be a little bit challenging. I have a box that is very explicit in it's directions. "Stand with the bridge on your right..." That kind of thing.

Or "Turn right on Park Avenue."

http://www.atlasquest.com/boards/message.html?gMsgId=54834

I seem to remember that one...; Everytime I see a Park Ave I grin.

teekasue

I took the original "concerns" as they were called and did go back and check to see if I was in a late night palnted haze or something but ....the clues are really quite obvious and there is really not one thing needs changing. Thanks for your comments I so appreciate all the thoughts and help. I think I get it at one end and then the other end wraps around and bite me some how! I am thinking I am goign to stay at this end of the pool for awhile and just ignore the "alotted time period had lapsed for decyphering clues" e-mails and just figure "to bad for them...missing a great destination and find....maybe more time will be alotted and it will get figured out ....NOT SURE but I hope so. I do wish you all luck finding it. I you are ever in Newport Beach, CA - look me up and I won't give you any hints...hehe

teekasue

Looking forward to the challenge! And the experience so far has been a fabulous one, just navagating new waters and learning "good form". It am always "kicking against something"...as my mom loving puts it. I just don't want to kick against somethng that I should no better than to kick...you know?? I am the only woman in the family of 12 men (except my mom) so I stand pretty well. I just needed a little guidance and for that I thank you....I love your comment :

"You now are learning what it's like to be an artist. An artist gives of themselves...often with little or no renumeration, but just because the love of creating something is so strong. Then they tentatively share it with friends and loved ones, and if they have enough courage...the world."

See I can't even do the pretty boxes y'all do but hey it's mine rihgt? ; ) Anyway thanks for the perspective it is much apreciated and much needed .

Happy & Merry
teekasue

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As a general rule, when someone sends me an e-mail asking for more info, I don't even reply.

hmm, what about a little common courtesy? I've written to ask for more help with clues, and received replies that confirmed I was in the right area, which is helpful but not giving anything new. A newbie might need just a little encouragement. Sometimes a box is actually missing, or the planter is MIA. I think that it is important to give a reply, but you don't need to add anything to your clues. It's the matter of communication that is worthy, even if it's a pat reply "thanks for the update" or "message received, thank you. recheck the clues" or "sorry, have nothing new for you."

Wildhair

I found out the hard way about asking for more info on a clue. It was when we were just starting out ( third or fourth box ), and I'm not all that great with the compass. I had read somewhere that you could ask the planter for a little extra help if you were having trouble, but I never got an answer.

*shrug*

That dosen't mean that I've quit trying! I decided that I would practice more with the compass, and then go back and try again! If I don't find the box the first (or third try ), I just go to another one, and then come back. Sometimes, you just need a little break from one that is giving you trouble!

But, I would never actually criticize a planter because I couldn't find the box! Well, not to them, anyway! What I say out in the wild is for me and the trees to know! Heehee! ;) <--Joke!

I say, as long as the hubby can find it, it's good!

Merry Christmas!!

moonshowr

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hmm, what about a little common courtesy? I've written to ask for more help with clues, and received replies that confirmed I was in the right area, which is helpful but not giving anything new. A newbie might need just a little encouragement. Sometimes a box is actually missing, or the planter is MIA. I think that it is important to give a reply, but you don't need to add anything to your clues. It's the matter of communication that is worthy, even if it's a pat reply "thanks for the update" or "message received, thank you. recheck the clues" or "sorry, have nothing new for you."

oh, and the sender of the e-mail can find out when you have read your mail, it shows up as read in your sent mail box!
SS

As an artist, I just wanted to add a couple of thoughts...

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Because they give of themselves with their valuable time and thought and money, it is sometimes hard to take criticism.

When you put your art out for public consuption, you should expect criticism. Yes, you read that correctly. EXPECT criticism. Everyone's a critic. Sometimes it's good, sometimes it's bad, but art is, in large part, specifically designed to elicit response from the observer. It's what drives a great many of us to create.

Yes, some criticisms are more difficult to take than others. However, you must remember, they're generally not criticising you as a human, a mother/friend/boxer/whatever, a wine lover, or what-have-you. Point being, it's not personal (generally). It's a reflection of someone's experience to your artwork. Yes, at times it can be difficult to separate the two, when you're emtionally invested in the pieces you produce. You learn quickly, though, to take the good with the bad, or you quit producing art....and that, in my opinion, is the most tragic outcome of all.

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until I feel he is exerting control over my realm, or he feels I am exerting control over his

I like to think of listing my 'babies' on AQ the same way I would listing my more formal artworks at a gallery. There are rules, regulations, stipulations, etc, that are just part of the game of getting your artwork out there to the public. If I don't want to follow the rules of a particular gallery, I'm free to take them to another, or create my own show, or any number of other ways. But, when you agree to show your art within someone else's construts, you're bound by the way they decide to show your art.

It's not so very different here.

Just my opinion in this tempest in a teapot. :-)

Jenni P McD

Here's my suggestions, for what it's worth.

If you don't want to change the clues, then don't. :-)

But, expect people like me to ask if they get stuck on something. I'm from the 'it can't hurt to ask' school, and the worst thing you can say is 'no'. If you do, I say, 'thanks anyway; happy boxing,' and move on...and I may or may not try the box, depending on the situation.

Now, that's just me. I find asking part of the hunt. Many don't. However, given my area and lack of boxes, I'm making long drives with young children. I"m not asking for special help/clues/guidance or anything you're not willing to part with, but many people in my area ARE willing to be of additional assistance if requested. Maybe we just have a different concept of boxing...I don't know.

As for suggestions regarding plants/clues, sometimes I *DO* offer these, as I"m also a planter, and I offer a thought/suggestion to a box that perhaps the owner didn't think of. I would hope others would do the same for me regarding my boxes. I ALWAYS include the caveat that 'this is just a suggestions, and thought I'd add it. Take if for what it's worth, but you may want to consider...." If they do or don't is no skin off my nose. I look at is as looking after others boxes like I hope others will look after mine. That's all.

Happy trails.

Jenni P McD

Ahh yes...I should have said "it's hard to take rude and/or hateful criticism."Criticism of art is a given and I didn't phrase that as I should. I do not take it personally or think that judging my art is judging ME....but thanks for pointing it out....as beginners or youngesters may feel that way.

As for the "you're bound by the way they decide to show your art", I ALSO agree. I have had my work exhibited before. I just would like to be asked before my work is re-framed, re-lit, relabeled and moved to another wall. THAT is only common courtesy. Then I at least have the time to make other arrangements.

LW PhD

"Nice Counts"

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oh, and the sender of the e-mail can find out when you have read your mail, it shows up as read in your sent mail box!

Not necessarily. If emails are forwarded to a person's alternate email address, they show up immediately as read even if the reader hasn't yet read it in their personal email.

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come to find out that MapQuest has incorrectly labelled one of the Porter Lakes as Little Porter Lake and left the real Little Porter Lake unlabelled.

This is exactlly the kind of thing I was talking about when AQ first added the map feature and is why I personally don't like it.

It's not just Mapquest they all have flaws

Shiloh

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I should have said "it's hard to take rude and/or hateful criticism."Criticism of art is a given and I didn't phrase that as I should. I do not take it personally or think that judging my art is judging ME....but thanks for pointing it out....as beginners or youngesters may feel that way.

No problem, and I wasn't really thinking you, specifically, given what I have read in your posts before. I got the feeling you had a good deal of experience in the art world. I think we artist tend to assume (wrongly, myself included) that everyone has that thick artist skin that we have, even though we've been developing it over a career...lol...a lot of times since kindergarten when we were told we shouldn't color outside the lines or that grass shouldn't be pink. :-) For many people in this hobby, carving and planting is the first artistic attempts they've tried since school (if they even HAD art in school, but that's another WHOLE conversation), and I just wanted to point out, mainly to those who may be reading this thread, that criticism is going to happen...it's just a part of life in the creative world. Even when it is hard/hateful/rude, very rarely is it personal to the artist.

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I just would like to be asked before my work is re-framed, re-lit, relabeled and moved to another wall. THAT is only common courtesy. Then I at least have the time to make other arrangements.

Then you've had better luck with the galleries you've worked with than I have. :-) Most I've dealt with have a caveat in their contracts that allow them to rehang/redisplay current art as they see fit as previous works move out and new works move in. I'd love to have that front main wall with the great lighting the whole time my art is in a particular gallery, but it doesn't always work that way. However, the artwork IS my property, and I always am sure to retain the right to remove it at any time I feel the relationship between myself and the gallery isn't working. Yes, many galleries work as best they can to accomdate artists, but it's not a given they'll contact me immediately regarding immenient changes. They also have more than one person serving 7000+ artists and customers.

Jenni P McD

You will never please all people. Please yourself & make a clue you are happy with.

If people are finding the box most of the time- even some of the time- you are doing fine. Politely reply that the box is there, & that they should try again... or try a different box. I have had people suggest how I can improve my clues (I always enjoy that one) which usually happens when they didn't start at the beginning of the clue. I also have people who have MOVED my box to where they "thought" it should be based on their interpretation of the clue (& yet they found it!). Recently it was moved again- although I think it was just because they might have taken it away to box in & forgotten which triple trunked tree they had retrieved it from. I haven't had a chance to move it back yet but hope to over the holidays. Ah, the joys of boxing... :)

Happy Holidays!
The Family

No kidding about the mapquest flaws. We were following along the preprinted map only to discover the overlays for the interstates and local roads with exits/entrances to them didn't align properly. The local road we were looking for was beyond the road that appeared to be the entrance ramp to the interstate. And of course, the road did not have the local street name on it, just signs pointing to the interstate. Drove past this point and turned around only to see the local sign name on the north bound side of the road we needed. And yes, it was the road that led to the interstate. So we took our best guess and found the way to our destination by using common sense. And my keen sense of direction.

speedsquare

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I found out the hard way about asking for more info on a clue.

Then there was the letterboxer who, on the hunt for one of my boxes, whipped out his cell phone and called me up!

thanks for that info...nice to know!!!

teekasue

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Then there was the letterboxer who, on the hunt for one of my boxes, whipped out his cell phone and called me up!

How did he get your number???? If you gave it on the clues well then I would say that you got what you ask for. If he is a close enough friend to have your cell number I can say that I don't blame him I would call a friend to ask about there clue if I was having trouble.

Mystic Dreamer
who wishes she could have contacted a planter today to find the park that the box was planted in (I think that I might have been on the oppisite side of the city.)

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We totally agree on the "Not all boxes are for everybody" concept. In instances where people have requested clues to be easier or whatever, I politely remind requesters of that. If they appear to fresh to the game, I do suggest some easier boxes specifically designed for Family Fun. Usually, that results in happy new people, if they choose to make the effort. If they are seasoned boxers just looking for a free and easy ride, I do not suggest a nearby easy box.

Have a joyous Holiday season,

LB

Awww... come on, no free and easy ride??? ;-)

I totally agree here. I sometimes will give a hint or a push one way or another, but often the clues are ambiguous for a reason. I always say that there is a letterbox for everyone, it is what makes it fun.

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As a general rule, when someone sends me an e-mail asking for more info, I don't even reply. I'd just as soon they not even know for certain that I got the e-mail.

I find that just plain rude. While I am not known for timely replys, I at the very least will e-mail them back and tell them I can help them no further then the clues. That is being just plain polite.

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Then there was the letterboxer who, on the hunt for one of my boxes, whipped out his cell phone and called me up!

Uh.... actually, I've done that. *waves at LW* I have not a problem with it. I'm very very good at following directions and figuring things out in my head that could be alternatives to what I'm thinking. For example, if a clue reads "look in the tree", and I don't immediately find it... I will touch every part of that damn tree and every one around it until I feel like I've exhausted every possibility.

On one of LWs boxes, I knew damn well I was in the right spot, and I tore that damn thing apart, touching every icky yucky portion of that stupid rock wall. Then, I went and looked on a completely different rock wall just in case. Performing searches was part of my living not too far back, so I can definitely execute an effective, thorough search! Well, it wasn't there. So, yepper, I took that celly out and rang her up. I get worried! I want to make sure it's not missing. Especially since she has so many... I don't want to list it as missing and then have her check for it to be sitting right there!!!

Anyway, when it comes to editing clues, I would definitely agree that if the clue is purposefully challenging and others have found it without complaint, then live on and let go. BUT, there must be room for those clues that tell you to look for a damn rock next to a tall tree in the middle of a fricken forest. We all know what I'm talking about... yeah... those clues. And so, if there is a chance that perhaps they are insinuating that maybe the clue reads like one of those clues, then perhaps a little editing wouldn't be such a bad thing.

-Infinity

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people who have MOVED my box

See, there's a big problem sometimes. We have found a couple of boxes that had obviously been "replaced" in a different spot--like in front of the tree instead of behind. There was one that had been left OUT IN THE OPEN on a stump nearby.
One had been washed down a gulley and was under debris maybe 5 feet away from the tree it was supposed to be behind. The only suggestion we have gotten about our placement was a suggestion to put a rock on top of our Cow Killer box, so that it wouldn't get washed out in a heavy downpour. (Thanks Mama Wolf. That was a good idea.) We found one the other day that had a note in it from a muggle that she had taken it home and then brought it back. We rehid that one better than found. It wasn't the placer's fault, it was the finder who didn't rehide well. I'm following Mama Wolf's advice and putting a rock on top of all my boxes that I plant.
Chickadee

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I'm following Mama Wolf's advice and putting a rock on top of all my boxes that I plant.

yep...I am kinda fond of those weighty little rocks too :)
I don't have one on ALL my boxes but I do have one on EACH box that is hidden in a way to make a rock practical :)