Skip to Content
Register · Login
About Theme

A Letterboxing Community

Atlas Quest
Search Edit Search

Read Thread: boxing at state parks

Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #69431 by 4 Auburn Fans
Feb 14, 2007 10:16pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote What's up with the FL state parks? Are letterboxes/ers welcome?


AFAIK, letterboxes/ers have not been banned in any public areas of Florida. However, there are several different organizations involved -- State Parks, State Forests, State Preserves, State Wildlife Management Areas all seem to be run by different departments and nobody knows what anybody else is doing -- and increasingly each of them is requiring "permits" to plant. The WMA's and Forests in particular definitely do require such permits now, the others won't be far behind if they don't already. It took me two months to get permits for some of my boxes.

You can apply for a permit and wait, or you can do what I'm doing these days: hiding without letting them know. Then follow some of these tips:

* Hide really well so the box will not likely ever be found accidentally; that's not a problem for letterboxers, you can tell them exactly how to find it no matter how well hidden it is.

* Avoid using the name of the park in the name of the box, and even in the clues if you can help it.

* Require a find count to see the clues. Even if it's a find count of just 1, that'll keep search engines from finding the listing.

* Check the box here on AQ to try to prevent search engines from searching the clues.

* If you want to be doubly secure about it, make it a two-stage letterbox with the first stage outside the park in some public area. Tell boxers how to find that box in the clues. Inside the box provide directions how to find the second box inside the park. Hence, the directions to the box inside the park don't exist online, you actually have to find a letterbox to see them.

There's a couple of other things you can do, but if I told you I'd have to kill you.

And don't worry about fines for littering. That battle has been fought and won in the courts, geocaches and letterboxes are not litter. They can throw your box away, and they can possibly fine you for violating their policy on permits, but they can't fine you for littering.

-- Kirbert
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #71956 by Kirbert
Feb 16, 2007 11:00am
Thread (disabled) Board
Thanks Kirber, you really know your stuff! I like the idea of hiding the box outside the park, then "sneaking" in to find a bonus!!

Incidentally, I think we may have crossed paths in P-cola in search of the 5 flags series...???

Looking forward to some plants this summer in the sunshine state.
A
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #71956 by Kirbert
Feb 17, 2007 6:51pm
Thread (disabled) Board
That is very fascinating about the court thing! Does anyone know anywhere I could read about the court's ruling?

chadams
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #69431 by 4 Auburn Fans
Feb 17, 2007 7:50pm
Thread (disabled) Board
I know nothing about the state of FL's official guidelines, but we had a series in a State Park there that were seized. I got this message a few weeks ago:

"Apparently your(3)letter boxes were seized by park patrol some time ago. I, however, just came across them. They are currently located at the park ranger station (front enrance) at xxxxx State Park in xxxx. Call (xxx)xxx-xxxx and ask for me, Ranger ___, or the assistant park manager, ____. If it will be easier for you, I can send the boxes back to xxxx office in xxxxx for pick up."

The series was on the panhandle. I have arrange for someone to pick these up in a few weeks.

Don't know if this is an isolated incident or not.

MM/123F.
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #69431 by 4 Auburn Fans
Feb 17, 2007 8:03pm
Thread (disabled) Board
I know there are a lot in the Myakka state park in Sarasota.

I also know some parks encourage it like the ones in CT. they actually plant the boxes themselves out there to get people to visit the parks.

KBgirl
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #72626 by chadams
Feb 18, 2007 11:20am
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote That is very fascinating about the court thing! Does anyone know anywhere I could read about the court's ruling?


It was discussed on the geocaching.com forums. Try a search there.

-- Kirbert
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #72637 by She Runs
Feb 18, 2007 11:22am
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote "Apparently your(3)letter boxes were seized by park patrol some time ago."


If you want to avoid this kind of hassle, you need to make doubly sure your boxes cannot be found by the park patrol.

-- Kirbert
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #72642 by KBgirl
Feb 18, 2007 11:31am
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote I also know some parks encourage it like the ones in CT. they actually plant the boxes themselves out there to get people to visit the parks.


I have found a geocache planted by the park rangers -- here in Florida, the same state where they're now cracking down on boxes and requiring permits, etc.

It probably is a function of how far up the bureaucracy you get. When geocaching and letterboxing were relatively unknown and you were only dealing with the local rangers, you very likely could find some that got a kick out of the idea and supported it. Once the Tallahassee desk jockeys got wind of what was going on, though, of course the red tape started to fly.

In Georgia there's a very interesting geocache at Tallulah Falls. It has a padlock on it. It was placed by local geocachers with permission of the park authorities. Only one geocache was permitted as an experiment. They insisted on the padlock to keep muggles from putting bombs in the box or some such nonsense. The combination to the padlock is given in the cache listing. The cache is hidden along a trail that you are supposed to get a permit to be on, so you're supposed to sign in at the office and state that you're hunting the geocache before you even set out.

-- Kirbert
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #72626 by chadams
Feb 19, 2007 6:21pm
Thread (disabled) Board
This is the AQ mail I received just today about a series I planted at a Florida State Park last weekend.

Hello Geometry Junkie:

It has come to the park systems attention that individuals are utilizing state parks as an area to hide letterboxes (not unlike Geocaching). We are delighted that you are using our park as part of your treasure hunt; the park system though, has requested that we contact the person who has placed the letterboxes in the park. This is an initial contact to coordinate with you as the individual who has placed the letterboxes in our park. Please contact me at . . .
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73167 by Geometry Junkie
Feb 19, 2007 6:33pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote "We are delighted that you are using our park as part of your treasure hunt;"


How did they find out? Because the objective is to make sure they don't find out, so we need to know what to do differently.

Quote "the park system though, has requested that we contact the person who has placed the letterboxes in the park. This is an initial contact to coordinate with you as the individual who has placed the letterboxes in our park. Please contact me at . . ."


Their "initial contact" will be followed by a polite request to fill out an application for a permit. The permit will make it clear that you are responsible for everything including the weather if you sign on the dotted line. After sending in the application, you'll wait two months to get that permit. Then you'll have to go visit your box (no biggie, you've already signed up to visit it monthly anyway) and apply the permit. Any boxes found without permits will get tossed -- which makes one wonder why it wasn't tossed during those two months you were waiting for the permit!

Come join us on the dark side! Plant your boxes where the park authorities will never find them, and list the clues where the park authorities will never find them!

-- Kirbert
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73167 by Geometry Junkie
Feb 19, 2007 7:03pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote requested that we contact the person who has placed the letterboxes in the park.


Might we ask the name of your box that they found? I'd like to review your clues.
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73170 by Kirbert
Feb 19, 2007 7:30pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote Come join us on the dark side! Plant your boxes where the park authorities will never find them, and list the clues where the park authorities will never find them!


Be careful of the Dark Side...and plant with stealth as you please.

Your humble servant,
OBJuan
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73173 by Shadohart
Feb 20, 2007 6:09am
Thread (disabled) Board
As far as I know, they did not find the box(es). If they had, they would have contacted me on my regular e-mail. I put my yahoo address in every one of my boxes.

I think this person did an AQ or LBNA search and found the boxes listed there. She registered with AQ yesterday and contacted me through AQ.

When I got the e-mail, I altered the listing. I added an F-count of 10, and I took the name of the park out of the listing. They boxes are called "Swamp Thangs." The park is in White Springs, Florida.

Geometry Junkie
Mandy
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73251 by Geometry Junkie
Feb 20, 2007 6:23am
Thread (disabled) Board
I saw this....

I have started taking the same types of precautions....small F count, no spelled out place names, etc.

Small things, but it helps.

Jenni P McD
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73255 by Jenni P McD
Feb 20, 2007 10:36am
Thread (disabled) Board
Our boxes that were seized had the listed county, and a description of the park, but no proper name. But it wouldn't have taken much to figure out which one they were in, and this was by design. We have arranged for these boxes to be picked up and retired, as we are not in the area. If we were, we certainly would reconsider alternatives.

MM/123Family
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73251 by Geometry Junkie
Feb 20, 2007 6:48pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote I think this person did an AQ or LBNA search and found the boxes listed there. She registered with AQ yesterday and contacted me through AQ.

When I got the e-mail, I altered the listing. I added an F-count of 10, and I took the name of the park out of the listing. They boxes are called "Swamp Thangs." The park is in White Springs, Florida.


Ahhh ok. Thanks. That's really what I was wondering anyway. Things not to do in the clues to help avoid boxing being found. No offense meant by that though.

Thanks for sharing!
Tee
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73167 by Geometry Junkie
Feb 21, 2007 5:06pm
Thread (disabled) Board
I wanted to let y'all know that everything seems to have worked out with my boxes at a Florida State Park. I finally got in touch with the lady who AQ-mailed me. She received an e-mail from Tallahassee and had to find out the location of the boxes. She said that she had to make sure they weren't in a "sensitive area." She also stated that the boxes would be removed before a prescribed burn and replanted afterward. I told her which trail the boxes were on, and she said that they were in a recreational area, and that was fine. The lady was extremely nice. There was no talk of confiscation or permits.

A Very Pleased,
Geometry Junkie
Mandy
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73707 by Geometry Junkie
Feb 21, 2007 5:14pm
Thread (disabled) Board
That's really cool! Glad it worked out so well.

JPMcD
Re: boxing at state parks
Board: State: Florida
Reply to: #73170 by Kirbert
Mar 3, 2007 10:32am
Thread (disabled) Board
The dark side isn't so bad. I just rewrote all my clues recently. I'm actually enjoying having all my clues in one document file. :o)

Three Hearts