Greetings,
In Atlas Quest, Ryan has created a wonderful tool for all of us to use. I was very pleased to be a part of it during its early developmental stages, flattered to have one of my photos chosen for this year’s calendar and love much of what I find to use here. I like to select those colors for my clue pages and REALLY love tbeing able to upload photos as illustrations for my clues. The search functions are killer. Getting clues on my cell phone is fantastic. There are a few things I am not interest in using but those who like them have the opportunity to use them and I can choose to ignore them.

When the dreaded Blue Diamonds appeared, many folks were vocal in giving their negative opinions. In his usual effort to please, Ryan made this an option, not a requirement for participation on the site. The mapping feature is optional. This week, the extended finders list appended to all clues made its appearance. I would be happy as a pig in mud if this were made an optional feature but that doesn’t seem to be a possiblity. It seems to me that multiple attempted finds noted in italicized red type would tend to discourage folks from searching for some of my trickier boxes when I know they are alive and well. I really don’t want anything added to my clues that I cannot edit, delete or disable.

Wanting to support Ryan as a friend, I have used his site to host my clues since it first went online over two years ago. In the same vein, I bought a Premium Membership from its inception. However, this new feature is a deal breaker for me. Sadly, I feel compelled to remove my clues from the AQ database. I hate to throw away all the hours it took me to enter over 200 boxes here but I am in the process of listing them only on LbNA. I want to apologize to those of you who enjoy keeping an online logbook here. I really don’t want to mess things up for you but I really don’t want to feel compelled to participate in something I don’t care for.

I’ll still be a member here. Only my clues are jumping ship. Man oh man, am I gonna miss that clue hit counter!... Funhog

It is very unfortunate that you feel this way. It is also unfortunate that people see attempts and automatically assume that the box is missing instead of going to search for it themselves. But I guess I just don't understand the problem with everyone seeing the list of finders. I know I definitely wouldn't want to switch clues to 200 boxes over to LbNA. But they are your boxes - do what you want. Just remember - everything changes and you have to learn to adapt.

TG

Quote

It seems to me that multiple attempted finds noted in italicized red type would tend to discourage folks from searching for some of my trickier boxes when I know they are alive and well.

I don't use the 'attempt "button" for that one fact... It could be there, and I'm just not 'seeing' it, or it could be that it has indeed gone missing. I am not too hasty to judge so I don't 'push' that 'toggle', even if I have *searched* for it for over a year!!

I have a few mysteries that have been 'attempted' and are still 'active', however, I will leave it up to the seekers to chose to to look or not.... I will NOT change the clues!! Those who found it deserve it and I will NOT take that satisfaction away from them!

Ryan has done a great job with this site, and has tried to accomodate all who use it, you can not *please all of the people all of the time*. With the many users giving their 'indivdual' input, I'm surprised that TG has not *Imploded* yet!

If the Users do not like a 'listing'/ 'rating'/ 'option' of a box, TG will come up with a way to 'toggle' to ignore it.!.. :)

Hang in there Funhog, I am sure the *tweaking* isn't done yet!

(IMHO I would like the *wet blanket* icon for those who 'opt' out on certain features ..;). (if it's not too much trouble...)

~Chunna~

Quote

It seems to me that multiple attempted finds noted in italicized red type would tend to discourage folks from searching

I am afraid I just don't understand what all the fuss is about. Attempted finds have been there since I joined, to me there is no difference between stars and red italics. Now there is even a button so you can ignore that feature if you want to.

If there is something I don't like, I just ignore it. There are enough people in the world for someone to find a use for everything. There are other letterboxing websites that I haven't got time for and they haven't even noticed I am not there.

I am still amazed that websites like this can be created. What is even more amazing is that someone would be willing to share that creation and allow others to join in with suggestions.

YT

I am unsure and I really don't know Funhog...so forgive me if I'm off base...
but I am afraid funhog feels hurt and
I just feel like it may be more than red italics that has caused this.

Oh Funhog! Please don't jump ship!

I feel as though the red italics should be seen for the planter only, and not for everyone to see. I'm glad that Green Tortuga has put a feature in called "show all finds." I wish this could be a feature we could turn off though. Can we do this as a planter preference? Maybe we don't want people to know who found the boxes and who attempted etc.... ;-)

I personally liked it before when all we would see is the last finder (not the attempts or anything), and just the planter saw all of the find and attempted finds. I wish it was something we could switch on and off.... I think that can be done on LBNA.

Just my 1 1/2 cents since it's so early in the AM.

Music Woman

Attempted finds are just that..........and have nothing to actually do with the box.....these are attributes of the people searching. I have been notified of boxes that people ATTEMPTED to find and they were exactly where the clues said. I have also had boxes that were ATTEMPTED and they were, in fact, missing. ATTEMPTED means just that, and anyone who reads more into that marking may be missing out on a dynamite box. But, that is their choice too.

As for Funhog moving her listings to LBNA, I sure wouldn't go to all that trouble, but that is her choice and she is free to do as she pleases. This is, afterall, a hobby........and the "rules" are arbitrary.....no box police are going to come get us if we screw up.

Quote

It seems to me that multiple attempted finds noted in italicized red type would tend to discourage folks from searching

Call me weird, or something like that (go ahead everyone does), I like the fact that there are "attempted" finds.

I look at it this way...(I know its me)... its more of a challenge to find. If it is missing it is usually updated as such. I also get an extra attaboy when I find it when there have been attempts placed on the box. What a great feeling to find a box that some people cannot find. When it comes down to it, so what if it really is missing... I wanna find it, I wanna go through the journey there, if its gone, "Oh Well", at least I got to see a neat place I never would of been unless there was a caring letterboxer to place a box there in the first place...

Look at it this way.....Its a journey, whether you take it by yourself or that someone special, its the journey there. It is the conversation that you had with your companion, or heck a conversation to yourself... either way that the great thing about this hobby.

This is in my humble opinion of course but I like the Pepe's slogan, "Just get out there and box", if you skip a box because there are multiple "attempts" you might be missing out on a great place to visit and if you are lucky enough to find it, then an extra "attaboy or attagirl" from me to you.

My .02,

BuxtonFFEMTI of Buxton Boxers

I will be sorry to see you go, FunHog. As everyone knows, I was appalled when BDs appeared, and I am not any happier with a PC (Planter's Choice) function. I hate "judging" boxes and I actually LIKE personal contact. Like when people write me a note, say they're going to be in the area and ask my opinion on which boxes would be good to get if they have their grandfather with them and can only spend an hour but like historical boxes with tricky clues. There are plenty of reasons I don't like these features, but I will confess that one of my most important reasons is a selfish one...I would miss the personal contact I have always had with boxers.

As for the attempted thing....sheesh. Bottom line, all of this "spoon feeding" drives me crazy. IMHO, "YOU GO LOOKIN' FOR A BOX...YOU TAKES YOUR CHANCES!" When I recently spent a day at Talcott Mountain, I looked for every box I could in the amount of time I had. That included mystery boxes, boxes by a fabulous carver named Northstar, boxes by the historically famous Jay Drew, boxes by lesser known carvers and boxes carved by beginners. I looked for boxes that were drivebys on the bottom of the mountain and for boxes that were hikes at the top of the mountain. I didn't need a Planter's Choice, a BD or anything else. And I was pleasantly surprised by each and every box I found and each and NOT devastated just because one of the boxes wasn't there...I still greatly enjoyed the hike and the company of some wonderful CT boxers.

So what I am trying to say, FunHog...is that I feel your pain, but I hope you will reconsider. I too, do not like the way certain features are "steering the hobby." But I also don't give a flying ---- if certain boxers pass by my boxes because I haven't allowed a BD or a PC icon to be on them. Those aren't the kind of boxers I'm trying to attract anyway. I want to appeal to boxers who enjoy a hidden spot they might not have known about...like trickier urban plants, or like to learn a little about local history. People who only collect the "prettiest" stamps......well, don't get me started.

Oh, and btw, I have paid my AQ dues to support Ryan mostly because I love the communities here and the ease of maintaining 200 boxes. I also truly love the ease of printing out shorter clue sheets and I couldn't live without signing on and seeing that red "You've got 15 letters" notice. :)

LW PhD

"Nice Counts"

Well, some folks probably *should* be discouraged by a string of "attempted finds." If I'm a newbie, and I know my finding skills aren't as well developed as someone who's been at this for years, then it might be a good decision for me to put off trying to find a box that's maybe a bit trickier than another until I have more experience. Doesn't mean they'll never go look for that box.

DebBee

Multiple attempts on a list may have a positive affect. The attempts list will likely encourage the types of boxers who enjoy a challenge, those who want to find something that many others could not find. They're in it for the challenge of deciphering the clues. People who put out challenging boxes are looking for these types of finders, right? Multiple attempts and a note in your clue page that the box is challenging will likely attract them.

Lone R

While I haven't jumped ship I am just spending less time on board and that suits me just fine. There are other ships! And no you don't have to adapt to these changes on AQ - just chart your own course as you have done. Congratulations! Norasta PhD

Quote

you don't have to adapt to these changes on AQ - just chart your own course as you have done

'Course not. We're all playing in the same sandbox, and not everything's going to be just the way any given member wants it. It's give and take, and yes, if it reaches a point where you're not able to live with it anymore, then it's time to find another playground.

Kinda like life.

DebBee

Quote

I don't use the 'attempt "button" for that one fact... It could be there, and I'm just not 'seeing' it, or it could be that it has indeed gone missing. I am not too hasty to judge so I don't 'push' that 'toggle', even if I have *searched* for it for over a year!!

That's just sad.

Quote

I have a few mysteries that have been 'attempted' and are still 'active', however, I will leave it up to the seekers to chose to to look or not.... I will NOT change the clues!! Those who found it deserve it and I will NOT take that satisfaction away from them!

Good! The best response to a bunch of DNF reports is one update by the owner that the box is still there and active, thereby confirming that it is a challenge while thumbing your nose at those who failed miserably to find it.

There are times when the clues should be changed. It's not because it was difficult; it was because you screwed up somehow, people are misunderstanding in ways you did not foresee and are wasting great amounts of time in frustration looking in all the wrong places.

Quote

Well, some folks probably *should* be discouraged by a string of "attempted finds." If I'm a newbie, and I know my finding skills aren't as well developed as someone who's been at this for years, then it might be a good decision for me to put off trying to find a box that's maybe a bit trickier than another until I have more experience. Doesn't mean they'll never go look for that box.

DebBee brings up a good point. I know when I first started I hit that attempted button a few times. Then this same point came up a while ago and I removed a lot of them. I do have some now in my log book on AQ which I am in the process of removing as soon as I get my personal Log Book up to date, so I can just record these attempts there.

I know too many log books, thats the OCD in me :o)

At first I was using it as a tool for my own tracking but then realized that everyone else could see that information and could sway them from looking for the box...which was not my intent.

Ok, so the point I am making is that "I" like trying to find these boxes that others cannot and its an added bonus when I find the box.

This is my only my view and decision. That is the great thing about AQ you can choose to use parts of it and choose to not use other parts. Playing the game your own way.

-Buxton Boxers

WOW- some pretty profound opinions on this thread of jumping ship.
While keeping MOHO silent regarding all the recent posts about recent "things"...here's just one viewpoint worth about .01 ......LESS IS MORE......
The unknown, the mystery, the surprise is valuable in and of itself-the more we know and are "guided" toward or away from something, the less of the surprise, unknown, mystery, and perhaps thrill will be there!
-kwmom
...this comes from somone who did not choose to know the gender of both my children before birth because there truly are few mysteries left in this world. Let me tell you, the "surprise" both times was invaluable and unforgettable. (not that there is anything wrong with choosing to know this information ahead of time-it was just our choice and we're glad we made it)
LESS IS MORE!

Quote

There are times when the clues should be changed. It's not because it was difficult; it was because you screwed up somehow

If I 'screw-up' the clues I change them (and I have)

Quote

people are misunderstanding in ways you did not foresee and are wasting great amounts of time in frustration looking in all the wrong places.

I am not 'making' them look for my boxes. If they feel they are wasting their time and/or find it frustrating, they can choose to ignore it