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Read Thread: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....

Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510734 by Spakinois
May 1, 2010 12:52am
Board
there are ways to find this person

How?
The kids on the school bus are driving me crazy lately and I need to release some anger. (ok, a lot of anger and frustration)
Where is she/he? Let me at them. :)
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510730 by Lone R
May 1, 2010 1:17am
Board
Yes, we should all hide and seek responsibly, but, since when is every patch of moss, every leaf, and every bit of funghi considered a "sensitive ecosystem"? I am also amazed by all of the lovely pictures of the fragile biological matter which has apparently managed to survive the carnage inflicted upon these sites by villainous geocachers and manaical letterboxers! Please!
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510779 by SpyCat
May 1, 2010 5:27am
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What about the animals out there? The deer, antelope, bear, etc. Don't they walk through the forests trampling twigs, brush, sitting on stumps and walking on logs? I hope this memo went out to them too.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510773 by OhanaTribe
May 1, 2010 6:00am
Board
He/she/they are trampling all over the precious environment they're trying to "save" in order to retrieve and destroy the boxes. And fussing about hiding a letterbox in a DEAD root stump... really? But he/she/they called it an "ancient" dead root stump, so it *must* be worthy of saving from evil letterboxers so that it can, you know, um... continue on it's job of rotting away unimpeded. (?!?)

I think his beef is that moss and mushrooms and fungus and things won't grow there because of the box and the people going to and from. But then he takes a picture of several different kinds on nearby plants and bushes and even labels them as growing "Close by" so I don't see what the huge issue is that ONE stump might not be home to the fungus. Particularly when anyone who passed high school biology knows that most moss and fungi grow like an underground carpet, skipping over areas it doesn't find suitable and continuing on unimpeded on the other side.

EDIT TO ADD: Oh, and I almost forgot to mention, not only does it grow in carpets, it will grow on ALMOST ANYTHING. Meaning if no boxers came by that particular stump for awhile, say...a month or two...a mushroom could very easily grown in the earth that collects on top of the box itself. I don't see this as a major ecological issue.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510730 by Lone R
May 1, 2010 6:49am
Board
Lone R

Thanks for sharing this. I'm on the opposite side of the country but I appreciate the message: We do need to be reminded every now and then. We do need to take care of the environment and encourage the same in our peers. That being said I would be furious if a vigilante removed one of my letterboxes... but I appreciate what they are saying: We need to tread lightly and not damage the environment. We all have see bad letterbox placement decisions.

Geocachers here in Virginia outnumber letterboxers 20 to 1. Caches are everywhere... and they usually have collateral wear and tear in a twenty foot radius. A few of my letterboxer pals geocache.... but I just dont get it. To me it's garbage in a box... just like the vigilante blogged.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510813 by Gallant Rogue
May 1, 2010 7:47am
Board
I live on Whidbey Island, and I could l go out and collect whatever boxes this person hasn't managed to find.

Many of the Whidbey boxes are planted by folks who are not from around here. I could assume that you guys would like your box with me rather than in the trash. But I could also see that some of you may want to just take your clues down for a while and leave the box where it is. I would welcome feedback from the community about how you feel I should proceed (just start pulling, or wait for folks to ask me to). If I collect one of your boxes, I will let you know, and we can arrange for its return to you.

I also can get to Anacortes and Mt. Vernon/Burlington. If you have any boxes out there you'd like pulled, let me know.

I have a couple of busy weeks coming up, but I could get out as I can and get to what I can before this person does.

Thunderbird
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510730 by Lone R
May 1, 2010 8:23am
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What is most frustrating to me about what this so-called "Forest Defender" is doing is that s/he claims to be "saving" the areas by removing letterboxes and/or geocaches, yet doesn't realize that the majority of us who participate in this activity do it because we appreciate what the great outdoors has to offer. I know that there have been times when our family has left a park location in better condition than it was in by picking up stray plastic bags or other garbage on our way to/from a box. It's unfortunate that this yahoo has decided to strike at a community who in all likelihood would be an ally in this quest to clean up. I don't know about GCers, but aren't we asked in the etiquette and "rules" section NOT to go into protected areas and NOT to disturb areas that are delicate?

My family began letterboxing last year, as a way to get out and discover the natural beauty of Washington State. It has helped us to see that there ARE a lot of careless and destructive people out there, and I'm willing to bet that the ACTUAL trash we have found on the trails were not left by letterboxers. By participating in letterboxing I have grown to care a lot MORE about the environment and the impact of humans on the natural habitats of the planet. By getting out there on the trails and seeing it all for myself I have gained a 1st person perspective that I would never have had if I hadn't started letterboxing.

And now for the angry side of me: Jeez, what d-bag...
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510762 by Poodle Circus
May 1, 2010 9:00am
Board
You can read the discussion about this blogger on the geocaching boards here:
http://forums.groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=248332

The discussion is similar to what's being said here.

Love what said Bassonia said in response to another posters question:
"Why is walking up to the cache to take pictures (and remove it) any different that cachers on the hunt?"

Bassonia:
That was my first thought as well...but then I realized this guy is such an eco-angel, he just floats above the ground.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510813 by Gallant Rogue
May 1, 2010 9:19am
Board
I'm a geocacher too and haven't noticed, at least in the areas I've geocached in any serious destruction by geocachers - the worst I've seen that I could attribute to geocachers is bent grass and weeds, usually because the cache owner has provided poor coordinates and a non-hint. When I see this I note it in the log and add an additional waypoint in my online cache log in hopes of pinpointing the search for future finders. In my area at least, there are many cachers who also do the additional waypoint thing (groundspeak even made it an option when posting an online log).

The most destruction in the woods that I've seen I would attribute to homeless people, young boys, people who like to drink in the woods - broken beer and alcohol bottles, old clothes, old boards nailed to trees to make ladders and forts - lots of rusty nails sticking out old boards just scattered on the ground, mattresses, couches, campfires with cans and bottles left in the ashes, cigarette packs, water bottles, paper coffee cups, etc.

Anyway, I mostly wanted to put the call out to letterboxers in the area that some boxes may be gone and why they're not there anymore.

It's an unfortunate reminder that we sometimes have to deal with eco-vigilantly types and may have to move boxes and protect our clues. Thank gosh there aren't many of these types around and very often they get bored and move on. Hopefully the posts by some people letting him know he may have only made any damage worse by removing those boxes, will make him think carefully before taking another one.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510848 by Lone R
May 1, 2010 9:23am
Board
I would welcome feedback from the community about how you feel I should proceed (just start pulling, or wait for folks to ask me to). If I collect one of your boxes, I will let you know, and we can arrange for its return to you.

I am also on Whidbey Island, and I would NOT want my boxes removed. I think you should definitely NOT remove a box without the planter requesting it.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510856 by Wise Wanderer
May 1, 2010 9:40am
Board
More reason why to put F count and P counts on boxes. Sad, isn't it?
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510856 by Wise Wanderer
May 1, 2010 9:46am
Board
personally I'd want you to pick up my boxes... I'd much rather have them with you than being pulled and thrown away by this psycho chick.

Maiden
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510854 by Lone R
May 1, 2010 9:49am
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I just spent several hours cleaning up roadsides for my town's Earth Day cleanup. We picked up alcohol bottles, fast food containers, car parts, everything. This is the trash that is hurting our ecosystems, not carefully monitored letterboxes and geocaches. If this guy wants to help save our "fragile environments" he should start getting rid of the REAL trash.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510771 by Hufflepuff Lost
May 1, 2010 10:00am
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they will like spend 15+min looking in every other conceivable

EXACTLY!!!!! make that more like an hour if you're boxing with CloudWalker!
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510800 by Falling Rocks
May 1, 2010 10:04am
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Oh, and I almost forgot to mention, not only does it grow in carpets, it will grow on ALMOST ANYTHING.

That's for sure---even fences, rocks, sidewalks, pavement, and house siding.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510857 by Esmerelda
May 1, 2010 10:08am
Board
The hand in the picture removing the cache from a log is a woman's hand. Nice nails.

I was just about to make this same observation.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510878 by QueenMother'n'CloudWalker
May 1, 2010 10:36am
Board
There is one more point that I want to make about what this lunatic posted on their blog and then I am done with this dumbass:

They listed my trailname, first name, city and state on their blog and posted a picture of one of my boxes that they trashed. The blog post states that my box was planted on 'sacred Salish Indian grounds' giving me a 5 on their list of worst plants. That's funny, in the picture, there is a wooden railing that was put there by the city since where I planted my box was in a city park. Hmmm, maybe this blogger should contact the city and let them know that they put a city park on 'sacred Salish Indian grounds'.

Anyway, I looked to see if I could site this person for slander or defermation and found that there is nothing that I can do to get this person's blog removed. Since they only used my first name and not my full name, and did not include my social security number or information about bank institutions that I use, this does not constitute slander or any other form of invasion of privacy.

So, in the meantime, since this person has publicly stated that I have 'hundreds' of letterboxes planted all over the PNW and has included the links for Atlas Quest and letterboxing.org on his site, I have placed restrictions on all of my letterboxes on AQ in hopes that no more of my creations end up in the garbage.

My hope is that the dumbass will read the post that I left them on their blog and try to harrass me on AQ. That way I can get Wassa or GT to have them removed from AQ so they won't be able to access clues to everyone's boxes.

Camp Fire Lady
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510752 by wassamatta u
May 1, 2010 11:43am
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I live on the other side of the state, but I was very disappointed to read that a dear friend of mine's name "Disney Fan" and my mother "Mariner Fan Spokane" were both mentioned and one of their boxes destroyed! Eek! Not okay!

I have a couple of plants on that side of the state, and there is much less activity around here, so I am unsure how to restrict my boxes. I can understand that you may not want to publicly announce the "restrictions" on your boxes, but if someone could AQ mail me some advice on what would be reasonable to set my P and F count for, that would be greatly appreciated!

I am just beside myself about all of this, and I agree, there should be some way to get this blogger in trouble, or at the very least, have his blog removed.

My condolences to all the lost boxes...
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510871 by Maiden
May 1, 2010 11:56am
Board
interesting you think it's a chick. I noticed the long nails and hands in one of the pictures, and was thinking the same thing. Everyone else seems convinced it's a man.
--CC
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510895 by Celtic Cross
May 1, 2010 12:09pm
Board
I noticed the long nails and hands in one of the pictures...

I didn't even notice that... I was too impressed with how the planter had "suspended [the cache] within a hollow log on the beach."

HPL
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510896 by Hufflepuff Lost
May 1, 2010 12:10pm
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yeah, I was impressed with that one too!
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510897 by Celtic Cross
May 1, 2010 12:43pm
Board
Everyone else seems convinced it's a man.

I was thinking someone - a man - took the photo . . . . the woman's hand probably belongs to his companion. Whoever they are, they are self-righteous, eco-nazi's who would be better off picking up the litter in public parks rather than seeking out well-hidden, non-threatening private property and destroying it. That's called STEALING!!
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510905 by Wise Wanderer
May 1, 2010 4:16pm
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seeking out well-hidden, non-threatening private property and destroying it. That's called STEALING!!

I agree. Maybe they can't be nailed for slander, but what about stealing and the vandalism of other people's property. Do we forfeit our rights when we plant something on public property?
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510935 by QueenMother'n'CloudWalker
May 1, 2010 5:29pm
Board
I don't think we give up any rights . . . . the boxes are clearly marked who they belong to and why they're there. Suppose this jerk parked his car on a public street, and I decide I don't like the looks of it there . . . can I just take it and crash it??? I don't think so . . . .
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510948 by Wise Wanderer
May 1, 2010 5:35pm
Board
I don't think we give up any rights . . . . the boxes are clearly marked who they belong to and why they're there. Suppose this jerk parked his car on a public street, and I decide I don't like the looks of it there . . . can I just take it and crash it??? I don't think so . . . .

good points.......
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #510730 by Lone R
May 2, 2010 2:20am
Board
Personally i think this self proclaimed "environmental crusader" is much more of a terrorist! What makes this guy/girl think they have the right to remove responsibly placed letterboxes that people (myself included as 2 of my boxes are listed) have put a lot of effort into making???? These are works of art and as long as they are planted in responsible locations, as the vast majority of LBs are, including the 2 he/she removed that were mine, they are causing no harm to the environment. As someone already pointed out, by removing these boxes it only makes most people look harder for them, thereby causing more harm than good! This "environmental crusader" is bad for the environment! They should really think about what they are doing before they do it.
I have found at least a few of the boxes that they listed, and none of them were causing any harm. This person is acting very irresponsibly, and I can only hope that someday (soon) they realize it. I hate having to restrict my boxes but I, as well as many others, have been left with no other choice thanks to this buffoon. Also, as a few people have mentioned, I pick up any litter I find while looking for a box. In general letterboxers are very kind to the environment, not harmful. This person really needs to educate themselves about our wonderful hobby before criticizing us about it. What is wrong with this person?????
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #511009 by Captain Raehawk
May 2, 2010 3:05am
Board
So even though this person claims that all of the negative comments they recieved (which happen to be the ONLY comments they recieved) are a good thing, they have blocked any new comments and deleted all the old comments, I'm wondering if there is a way to send them a private messge. Does anyone know if this is even possible? I would like to know how they feel it's ok to comment on LBers real names, locations, etc without revealing their own. I feel that it would be good for us to call this person out and demand an answer, yet they blocked any public comments before I had the chance to comment. What an !@&*(@&*....
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #511009 by Captain Raehawk
May 2, 2010 9:05am
Board
Can the powers that be around here do some digging into IP numbers and/or accounts to see if there is one that has accessed the clues for all of the boxes identified as stolen? Seems like the person could be identified pretty readily.
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #511055 by Lightning Jeff
May 2, 2010 9:13am
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It appears as though he started on the LBA sight, since most boxes were listed there as well, and he apparently searched one that had gone missing years ago. But since he now accesses AQ as well, perhaps . . . . I sent a message to GT but no idea when he's gonna be in range of wireless signals. I'm goin' back to the hope that he falls into a pit of stinging nettles and yellow jackets, has a severe allergic reaction, and can't go near the woods again or he'll die a terrible death!!
Re: If you're wondering what happened to your letterboxes....
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #511060 by Wise Wanderer
May 2, 2010 9:33am
Board
Someone should plant a box specifically for this douchebag. Kind of a "surprise" if you will. We had some kids that kept smashing our pumpkins one year, so my dad covered the pumpkins in brake fluid or something of the sorts. Hehe... I'm sure someone could come up with something creative :)