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Read Thread: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!

Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Aug 5, 2008 1:57pm
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Zip 'em, zip 'em, zip 'em. Then, double check to make sure they're zipped.

Suddenly, I have five soaked logbooks. Most of them boxes that have remained dry for over a year.

Please, people! Take an extra moment to ZIP 'EM!
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262433 by The Toadfrogs
Aug 5, 2008 3:18pm
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Also People....PLEASE REMEMBER TO BE STEALTH AND RE HIDE BETTER THAN YOU FOUND IT. We have lost six boxes inside of two months.

The quackers
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262433 by The Toadfrogs
Aug 5, 2008 5:25pm
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Aw, thanks for the hugs. :o)
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262433 by The Toadfrogs
Aug 5, 2008 5:43pm
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What type of container is it in? I find lock n locks stay quite dry inside. Not that I advocate this but, I'm experimenting with one of my letterboxes - container is a lock n lock, logbook isn't in a baggie. It's been a couple of years and the logbook has never been wet, not even damp.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262535 by Lone R
Aug 5, 2008 9:21pm
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lone r, do you think that without the bags that the l-n-l is closed better and the need for the bag is gone?????? i have thought about not using a bag as well, as it seems to be a risk of it getting caught in the seal.

condo
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262641 by condo
Aug 6, 2008 7:22am
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lone r, do you think that without the bags that the l-n-l is closed better and the need for the bag is gone?????? i have thought about not using a bag as well, as it seems to be a risk of it getting caught in the seal.


Well, the risk of catching the baggie in the seal is gone but there's still a risk that someone might come along and not lock down the flaps. The box I'm experimenting with is in a nook under a rock in a forest. It never gets covered in water but will get wet from snow melt and rain. So far people have been very good about locking down the flaps. The box is also covered in camo-tape so putting the lid on backwards (rubber seal pointing towards the sky) can't happen because the holes in the flap (on the outside of the lid) are covered by tape. If you have a good leak-resistant container then the baggies are backup and don't need to be relied for the sole protection of the logbook.

On a scale of what is most important in terms of keeping the logbook dry I'd say:

1. A sturdy well-sealed container
2. Freezer bag (or industrial) quality baggies with sturdy zippers
3. Regular baggies that are replaced every 1-3 months, depending on the number of visits they get

One last thing. If you're going to go baggie-less be sure to put your stamp in a felt pouch so that the residual ink doesn't get all over the logbook.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262722 by Lone R
Aug 6, 2008 8:32am
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Quote If you're going to go baggie-less be sure to put your stamp in a felt pouch so that the residual ink doesn't get all over the logbook.


Or, you can do what I've seen Dixie and others do - put a felt piece on the bottom of your box, put the stamp on that, and logbook on top. I've seen a number of baggie-less logbooks in good shape in a L&L.

THis past weekend, I found a logbook that was soaked, in a baggie, in a non-L&L container. It was sitting in a bit of water, but possibly it had been in more water. The top on the plastic container closed ok.... but the bag it was in was so huge that it was difficult to close the top without catching the baggie - which is what I think had happened. I fixed the box as well as I could (replacement logbook, replacement baggie, and put the wet logbook in a separate baggie and left it in the box and emailed the planter - I was not somewhere that I could take it home, dry it out and replant). Sometimes stuff just happens though and a "LB first aid kit" comes in handy ;-))

Mama Fox
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262740 by The Little Foxes
Aug 6, 2008 9:06am
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Or, you can do what I've seen Dixie and others do - put a felt piece on the bottom of your box, put the stamp on that, and logbook on top


One thing I've done with many of my boxes that I never see anyone else doing is lining the bottom with a folded up paper napkin. My thought is that if a few drops of water get in the box, either from a leaky box or people boxing in the rain, they will be absorbed by the paper towel. If the towel starts to get damp it can simply be removed. It can also serve as a papertowel if the need arises.

When I find a wet box, after I dry it out, if the logbook is damp, I'll put some dry paper napkins in with it. Some of the moisture from the logbook will be absorbed by the paper napkin, which can be removed later. Otherwise there's no way for the damp logbook to dry out trapped in a waterproof box and it will get moldy.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262757 by Trailhead Tessie
Aug 6, 2008 9:30am
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One thing I've done with many of my boxes that I never see anyone else doing is lining the bottom with a folded up paper napkin


California seems to have some of these. i have found it very convenient to use the napkin.
The outside pocket of my backpack is for LB maintenance. Ziplocs, extra logbooks, paper napkins and sometimes extra felt. i also contact the placer telling them what i first aid i have given their box. Al have been appreciative. i figure "what goes around comes around."

deniserows
to her karma account
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262768 by deniserows
Aug 6, 2008 9:34am
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I found a box last week that the clue said it was doing well in April - now full of water. But when I found it, the April finders had stamped an index card and put it in another baggie - so it seemed apparent to me that the logbook was already wet when found in April. I replaced logbook, and triple bagged to hopefully keep the water out now. Time will tell. The planters were appreciative and I sent them their logbook after it dried out a bit.

Ü
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262722 by Lone R
Aug 6, 2008 10:07am
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thanks for all of those comments and ideas about going bagless. i learn so much from all of you. :J

condo
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262776 by condo
Aug 6, 2008 2:19pm
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Not to be a wet blanket (pun intended) but I've found TWO lock 'n' locks just this summer with water in them. I have found others previously. I wouldn't put out a letterbox without plastic bags around the book no matter what kind of containers I was using. In the damp Pacific Northwest where I live, extra napkins in a letterbox is just another place for mold to grow. Funhog
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262868 by Funhog
Aug 6, 2008 2:24pm
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I agree with Funhog. I would ALWAYS use plastic bags for everything, no matter what.

I understand about including the napkin to absorb moisture.

But my instinct was that it could end up being a wick that would encourage moisture to be brought into the box.

If the box doesn't get found very often, it would be mold city, like Funhog said. (Well without the "city")

KuKu
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262868 by Funhog
Aug 7, 2008 1:58pm
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Not to be a wet blanket (pun intended) but I've found TWO lock 'n' locks just this summer with water in them.


That's rather a pitty. I haven't used lock 'n' locks for my boxes as a general rule because they're so much more expensive than other alternatives, but I rather liked the idea of a box that didn't need ZipLocks. They are such wonderful boxes.

Any details about how the leak was caused? Cracked boxes? Not shut securely? ZipLock bag caught in the seal? Something else entirely?

-- Ryan
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #263262 by Green Tortuga
Aug 7, 2008 2:03pm
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Quote because they're so much more expensive than other alternatives, but I rather liked the idea of a box that didn't need ZipLocks


ok ryan what kind of containers do you use.......because my budget doesn't like them either.

condo
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #263266 by condo
Aug 7, 2008 4:32pm
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ok ryan what kind of containers do you use.......because my budget doesn't like them either.


I used to use mostly those cheap ZipLock plastic containers. They're surprisingly air tight. =) But they will crack over time. I tried some generic plastic containers and the Glad versions of them, but they seemed to crack even faster or leak even without cracks.

Nowadays, I'm more likely to use really small containers that I bought in mass at a dollar store. They aren't at all waterproof, but I don't care so much. I think of the container as mostly something to protect the ZipLock bags inside from getting holes. I also try to be more wise about where I plant boxes trying to find locations that make natural shelters from the rain. If the box can't get wet, then neither can the logbook. So tucked under a large rock or a nook in a tree where water won't collect. That kind of thing.

-- Ryan
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #263347 by Green Tortuga
Aug 8, 2008 3:23am
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Ditto

SM
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #263347 by Green Tortuga
Aug 8, 2008 3:48am
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Quote I also try to be more wise about where I plant boxes trying to find locations that make natural shelters from the rain.


Hey, I heard the NW was completely underwater. I had a sweatshirt that had a picture of a couple of guys in a boat. They were rowing out to cut down a tree. The caption read, "Oregonian Christmas Tree Crew." So, are you saying this was false advertising?

Janet (who has used lnl's on all three of her boxes. Two were the disintegrating variety, cuz they are gone)
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262535 by Lone R
Aug 11, 2008 6:53am
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I have done this for all of my boxes. Just a LnL with no baggies inside. I was afraid the bags would get caught between the container and the lid. My oldest has been out there about 8 months or so I'd say and it is still bone dry inside. I checked on it about 2 weeks ago.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262535 by Lone R
Aug 11, 2008 10:40am
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I'm experimenting with one of my letterboxes - container is a lock n lock, logbook isn't in a baggie.


I've been thinking of doing this, too... with all the extra plastic I am using now that I've started LBing, I'm thinking I need to take out stock in Ziploc! Personally, with the ziplocs I've used in lunches and in the fridge, I can't say that I find them to be very watertight anyway.

I recall someone mentioning that they had issues with people putting the LnL lids on upside-down so the seal was the wrong way. I guess in those situations the ziploc is your only hope of protection; but how frequently would that happen? I would think most people know how to put lids on containers! hehehe!

HPL
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #264969 by Hufflepuff Lost
Aug 11, 2008 1:03pm
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I'm experimenting with one of my letterboxes - container is a lock n lock, logbook isn't in a baggie.


I recall someone mentioning that they had issues with people putting the LnL lids on upside-down so the seal was the wrong way. I guess in those situations the ziploc is your only hope of protection; but how frequently would that happen? I would think most people know how to put lids on containers! hehehe!


I wouldn't ... I started just using LnLs without baggies. 4 times total (1 was 2 times on 1 box) someone put the stuff back together wrong and the logbook got wet. I KNOW you are gonna say I did not put those 3 boxes in dry spots. But ...

ONE of those times it was just not put back together at all. It was sitting out in the open in a sunken spot and was wet.

The 2 time loser box was sitting on a big flat rock in a tree trunk with a rock on top of it to put it above water ... just in case and to make it higher in the tree to hide it. When I found it after damage reports, both times, the rocks were in front of the box. The clues indicated that the box was sitting ON the rock and to please put it back ON the rock.

The other damage was a poor plant in that it was a spot that got soaked when it rained. If the LnL had been put together right, it would have been fine. If I had put in baggies, it might have been fine too.

I am back to baggies inside the LnL.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #265273 by Butterfly Suzy
Aug 11, 2008 1:13pm
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ONE of those times it was just not put back together at all. It was sitting out in the open in a sunken spot and was wet.


Of course in this case, zippy bags wouldn't help anyway. But I hear you in the other situations; this is why I haven't followed through on the experiment yet! It's sad when people don't "care for your gift" like you hope they will... I've been fortuate so far, but then I only have 2 boxes planted. (I am off to plant two more today! Yippee!)

HPL :o)
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #265318 by Hufflepuff Lost
Aug 11, 2008 1:46pm
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ONE of those times it was just not put back together at all. It was sitting out in the open in a sunken spot and was wet.


Of course in this case, zippy bags wouldn't help anyway.


HPL, that was an example of people not knowing how to use LnLs properly. Obviously, that person did not know how to use letterboxes properly!

I found a different letterbox this past week sitting on the trail out in the open. Someone else had logged in the same date. And, we were early in the day. We hurried up the trail, to the next several clues, to see if we could catch them. We never did and the rest of the boxes were returned to their spots. Not sure what happened on that one. Perhaps, someone ELSE saw the letterboxers with that box only and checked it out. Or, whatever. But, I am glad we came along.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #265318 by Hufflepuff Lost
Aug 11, 2008 2:44pm
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Quote this is why I haven't followed through on the experiment yet!


You're dealing with a moron that cannot figure out how to put the log book back into the L&L and close it up, and you think that by making this idiot have to put the log book into a baggie first and zip that up and then put it into the L&L and close it up, it's gonna work out any better?
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #265498 by Kirbert
Aug 11, 2008 8:36pm
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You're dealing with a moron that cannot figure out how to put the log book back into the L&L and close it up, and you think that by making this idiot have to put the log book into a baggie first and zip that up and then put it into the L&L and close it up, it's gonna work out any better?


Precisely! That's what I meant when I said:
Of course in this case, zippy bags wouldn't help anyway.


It was the other 2 situations she mentioned where the zippy bags could have helped... maybe.

HPL
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #265498 by Kirbert
Aug 12, 2008 12:59pm
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Recently I've notices that the 'zipper' type brands really suck for LBing. The Zipper gives out and can't be sealed up again. The accused may not realize that the zipper didn't zip and seal the baggie. I think I'm going to go with press and seal types from now on.

For the upside down L+L, I put my 'disclaimer' on white tape on the inside of the lid. I camo the boxes with Krylon, so I'd hope they'd figure out what side had the bright 'this is a letterbox' white note pasted on it, and what side was painted brown and green....
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #262433 by The Toadfrogs
Aug 12, 2008 1:37pm
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Quote What type of container is it in? I find lock n locks stay quite dry inside.


I use mostly LNL's now, but didn't when I first started planting. Of the ones that were reported damaged recently, one is an older Gladware container, which they've failed on me before, but the point is, if the bags are ZIPPED, then it wouldn't even be an issue. Another was a locking type container, and the lid wasn't even locked and the bags weren't zipped. A third was a taped bag/pouch thingy (necessary for it's location), which should be OBVIOUS that the interior bags should be sealed incase the outer bag failed.

Quote I've seen a number of baggie-less logbooks in good shape in a L&L.


I agree the LNL's stay quite dry, but I have seen a few with water in them, and a couple with the lids on upside down as well. I'll probably continue to use the bags just incase.

Quote I used to use mostly those cheap ZipLock plastic containers. They're surprisingly air tight. =) But they will crack over time. I tried some generic plastic containers and the Glad versions of them, but they seemed to crack even faster or leak even without cracks.


Totally agree. I checked on a box today I planted in a ZipLock container. It's been there for two years, and dry as a bone. Just needed some fresh baggies, and it was good to go. I've had to replace a number of my older boxes with the Glad containers. They're poop. While I'll agree with all of you the LNL's are best, they wouldn't even be necessary if people would ZIP THE BAGS!! One little zip and a check to make sure it's sealed, and voila, the logbook stays perfectly dry. Oh, in a perfect world . . .
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #266269 by moonowl
Aug 12, 2008 2:08pm
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Interestingly, one of the few L&Ls I've ever found with the lid upside down had the label on the inside and -- you guessed it -- it was on the outside of the box when I found it. It didn't have the camo paint, though, so hopefully that will make a difference.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #266304 by The Toadfrogs
Aug 12, 2008 6:17pm
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Quote While I'll agree with all of you the LNL's are best, they wouldn't even be necessary if people would ZIP THE BAGS!! One little zip and a check to make sure it's sealed, and voila, the logbook stays perfectly dry.


You're asking a lot, though. Many baggies are devilishly difficult to close properly, and the ones with a zipper on them may not seal no matter what you do. If a little dirt gets on the closure, forget it. Baggies shouldn't be considered the primary seal; they should only be considered a backup in case the primary seal -- the container -- is compromised for some reason.
Re: Zip the bags, zip the bags, zip the bags . . . PLEASE!
Board: Traditional Letterboxes
Reply to: #266328 by Otis' Friends
Aug 12, 2008 6:21pm
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Quote Interestingly, one of the few L&Ls I've ever found with the lid upside down had the label on the inside and -- you guessed it -- it was on the outside of the box when I found it. It didn't have the camo paint, though, so hopefully that will make a difference.


Oh, please! You're dealing with morons here; if they were laying sod, you'd have to remind them to lay it green side up. Your ONLY chance is to make it physically impossible to close the box incorrectly. You might try gluing a board across the top.