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Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246045 by Kirbert
Jul 1, 2008 7:52pm
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the rule for geocaches is 528 feet


So, I'm curious, since this board has several people who both geocache & letterbox...
Has anyone intentionally planted a geocache 100 or so feet away from a chosen spot for a letterbox? Seems like this would be a way to "stake a claim" in such a way as to be respected by both the letterboxing & geocaching communities.

ts
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246687 by turtle scout
Jul 1, 2008 8:00pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Has anyone intentionally planted a geocache 100 or so feet away from a chosen spot for a letterbox?


From my perspective here in CO...yeah right THAT'll be the day...that 'cachers even KNOW about boxing. You better FN believe I "play" with geocache no go zone at this point.... I have spoiled boxes, geoCRAP to prove it...

pre
who is annoyed beyond belief at "having" to move MY boxes that were there FIRST. See Es's posts which is where this whole thing started

Oh yeah and...I feel super anal ever time I do it...but I will not place a box any more, any where that does NOT say on back "stamp does NOT leave Letterbox" (I s-p-e-l-l out l-e-t-t-e-r-b-o-x for the r-e-a-d-i-n-g challenged)

sigh
GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246691 by preboxed
Jul 1, 2008 9:44pm
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Has anyone intentionally planted a geocache 100 or so feet away from a chosen spot for a letterbox?


i do. i have a GC in the woods and right across the street i have a LB. i figured the street would be the invisible force field to keep both "safe"

deniserows
2--2 --2--- hobbies are better than 1
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246691 by preboxed
Jul 2, 2008 12:55am
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote
Quote Has anyone intentionally planted a geocache 100 or so feet away from a chosen spot for a letterbox?

...yeah right THAT'll be the day...that 'cachers even KNOW about boxing.


I don't think he's talking about some random geocacher planting this geocache. I think he's talking about the owner of said letterbox planting the geocache so as to protect his letterbox from geocaching interlopers.

Haven't done it, but must admit it's an idea. Good excuse to use up a bunch of otherwise useless film canisters, too -- just roll up some paper and toss it in and call it a micro. Plant it someplace fairly obvious, preferably someplace you'd get to before you get to the letterbox location. Most geocachers will just turn around there and head back to the car after signing in.
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246691 by preboxed
Jul 2, 2008 1:02am
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote pre
who is annoyed beyond belief at "having" to move MY boxes that were there FIRST.


I hear ya. I'll tell you what's even more annoying, though, and that's having a stamp go missing and some trinket left in exchange.

Quote ...but I will not place a box any more, any where that does NOT say on back "stamp does NOT leave Letterbox" (I s-p-e-l-l out l-e-t-t-e-r-b-o-x for the r-e-a-d-i-n-g challenged)


Won't help. Actually, it probably will help, it just won't solve. It may keep the first dozen geocachers that stumble upon your box from stealing the stamp, whereas it would have been taken within the first three or four without such marking. But you can put flashing lights on that thing, somebody's eventually still gonna think it's cute and take it.
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246738 by Kirbert
Jul 2, 2008 9:00am
Thread (disabled) Board
But you can put flashing lights on that thing, somebody's eventually still gonna think it's cute and take it.


Maybe the letterbox planted next to said cache could have a stamp with a carving of "DO NOT TAKE THIS STAMP." Maybe we should set it up and take bets on how long it lasts before someone takes it.
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246738 by Kirbert
Jul 2, 2008 11:28am
Thread (disabled) Board
Kirbert,

I think you're right about eventually geocachers will inadvertently take the stamp.

Even writing "This is not a geocache" won't help because, if somebody glances at it, they'll see the word "geocache" and think they're good.

I do know LBer's have put the name of the box, the word "letterbox" and their email on the back of the stamp, which has sometimes helped for cachers to get the stamp back. But that doesn't help prevent the initial taking of the stamp, necessarily.

I have heard of chaining the stamp to the box, but I'm not even sure how to really do that. Also, I could see, even if done well, the stamp eventually could get broken badly from the hole and whatever lashes it. Have you done this, Kirbert, and how did it work? If so, do you have directions?

I want to ask you because I know you do extensive research on containers and stamps, etc. and I think you might have some good insights.

What about velcro-ing the stamp to the box? I could see a LNL having the stamp velcroed to the lid, with an outline of the shape of the stamp and even the words under the stamp "Stamp goes back here". It could also be at the bottom of the box.

There is some hook & loop tape out there that has a very strong adhesive, much stronger than the brand Velcro. (It has been sold for over a decade to rubber stampers for mounting unmounted stamps. You put one side of the tape on a few different size blocks of wood, and mount all the unmounted on the other. You stick the stamp on the right size block, stamp, peel it off.) Because of this, the tape is good for several thousand pulls.

The adhesive on the tape might get gooey on the plastic box and need to be replaced. Also, it would be hard to have the stamp in a bag or pouch or other protection.

Kirbert — and others — what are your thoughts on this?

KuKu
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246923 by KuKu
Jul 2, 2008 11:34am
Thread (disabled) Board
With the right LB container, you can make the stamp part of the box. I've done it with two micro boxes. Both of them even have bonus stamps. The carved stamp is superglues under the lid of the film case. Allow enough room to ensure the lid closes tightly but also make sure the stamp stick up enough to stamp easy. For the bonus stamp, I super glue the stamp to the outside lower (non lid side) of the film canister. The fact that the micro box is so small, geocachers can't really take or leave anything.
Re: GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246715 by deniserows
Jul 2, 2008 11:44am
Thread (disabled) Board
i figured the street would be the invisible force field to keep both "safe"


So, based on results in the logs, is the street adequately separating the geocachers from the letterboxers?

Has anyone else besides deniserows tried planting both in the same vicinity?

turtle scout
Re: GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246930 by turtle scout
Jul 2, 2008 12:37pm
Thread (disabled) Board
According to my log book in Birsd of a Feather, a geocacher says they have geocache on the same trail.
Re: GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246930 by turtle scout
Jul 2, 2008 1:46pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Has anyone else besides deniserows tried planting both in the same vicinity?


I have one box that I planted near (35 ft?) the location of a cache that had just gone missing. I assumed the cache owner was planning on finding a new location to place the cache, a very large one, but he decided to replant exactly in the same spot. Actually, he found my letterbox while he was scouting for a new hiding location. I told him that if any problems developed, let me know, and I would rehide in a new spot. So far so good. His cache is unusual in that he offers letterbox-style clues to get to it. AND he has his own professionally made personal stamp. Perhaps I can draw him to the dark side....
Re: GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246930 by turtle scout
Jul 2, 2008 3:37pm
Thread (disabled) Board
So, based on results in the logs, is the street adequately separating the geocachers from the letterboxers?


YEs it seems to be working. A lot of people hit my Welcome to Kodiak GC. So i hid my LB eight beside the Welcome to Kodiak sign itself. And only a 2 way street separates them. The GC is bungied to the tree. The LB is in a cairn.

deniserows
and welcomes all to Kodiak
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246923 by KuKu
Jul 2, 2008 10:28pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote I have heard of chaining the stamp to the box, but I'm not even sure how to really do that. Have you done this, Kirbert, and how did it work? If so, do you have directions?


I think it may have been my idea originally, but no, I haven't actually tried it. It'd be easy enough to attach a piece of Spiderwire to the stamp; you could drill a hole or use a screw or something. Attaching to the inside of the letterbox container is more challenging, though. It'd be easy to put a hole through it with a bolt and nut or some such, but you've just created a leak -- after all our efforts to try to obtain containers that are reliably watertight.

If I were planting a letterbox that I know would be accidentally found by geocachers, I'd do it and risk the leakage. However, I'd more likely decide not to plant that box there.

I suppose the question then resolves to the situation where the box already exists and the owner learns that someone has planted a geocache 20 feet away. This being the case, the owner has the choice of pulling the box, just leaving it there until the stamp gets taken, or fastening the stamp to the inside of the box.

Pulling the box isn't really useful, if you think about it; the stamp doesn't do you any good in your closet, and re-planting it somewhere else is a mediocre plan, it'd be better to plant a new stamp somewhere else. Just letting it get stolen is frustrating, unless some geocacher enjoying your stamp makes you happy. So fastening the stamp to the box may be the solution of choice.

To minimize the odds of leakage, I'd use a stainless steel screw, nut and washer -- or nylon ones, if you prefer. Choose a flat area of the container and drill an appropriate hole. Install the screw with the head on the outside and the washer and nut on the inside. Tighten the nut down hard enough to pull the head securely against the surface of the container. The actual sealing will be the underside of the head against the outside surface of the container. Nothing else in that assembly will be watertight, since water can happily run along threads between bolt and nut if it can get under that head.

Then you've gotta figure how to attach the Spiderwire to the end of that screw. You could use another nut. Maybe an electrical eyelet terminal that fits the screw.

Quote What about velcro-ing the stamp to the box? I could see a LNL having the stamp velcroed to the lid...


If it's a L&L, good luck getting the Velcro to stick to the plastic! When you pull the stamp off the Velcro, it'll take both layers of Velcro right with it. Then it won't stick back, so the finder will just toss it back in the box. Then the next geocacher will go home with it.
Re: GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246969 by Wereallinthistogether
Jul 2, 2008 10:32pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote According to my log book in Birsd of a Feather, a geocacher says they have geocache on the same trail.


Same trail doesn't mean much; they could be miles apart. It's linear distance that's important. Closer than 100 feet is increasingly risky, with closer than 20 feet or so meaning your box is going to be found by half the geocachers that come looking.
Re: GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #247010 by Trailhead Tessie
Jul 2, 2008 10:36pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote I told him that if any problems developed, let me know, and I would rehide in a new spot.


Gee, that's nice. A geocacher was real nice about my box, too, even agreed to help me maintain it. The first "problem that developed" was that the stamp went missing. As far as the geocache was concerned, no problems ever developed. While we get nonlinear about them taking our stamps, they don't mind at all when we stamp into their log books.
Re: GC's and LB's together: Was argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #247192 by Kirbert
Jul 3, 2008 6:29am
Thread (disabled) Board
Gee, that's nice. A geocacher was real nice about my box, too, even agreed to help me maintain it. The first "problem that developed" was that the stamp went missing. As far as the geocache was concerned, no problems ever developed. While we get nonlinear about them taking our stamps, they don't mind at all when we stamp into their log books.


Well, in this situation, I'm the one that created the potential problem, so if my stamp goes missing it will be my own fault. I should really find a new hiding place, but I really like where it is right now, right next to a scenic waterfall and well hidden so the teens that hang out won't find it. So at this point I'm just accepting the risk.
Stamp Staying was: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246923 by KuKu
Jul 3, 2008 9:56am
Thread (disabled) Board
How about glueing the stamp to the LOGBOOK. Make the cover of substantial weight, like matting board. You could write all over the cover... DO NOT TAKE LOGBOOK! or something along those lines. Make a felt pouch for the logbook and put it all in a ziploc with warnings of dire consequences should they take it. Than you could glue the felt pouch to the top of the loc n loc.
Or not. Hopefully after having to go through all that trouble to get the stamp they would have read all the instructions. i also put an insert that you can read through the top of the plastic about it being a letterbox and on the inside it says it again. The insert is somewhere around the boards. Its double sided and you can just print and fold it and tape it to the lid.

i would also include the some AQ insert about letterboxing free floating in a ziploc in the box.

deniserows
with all her synapses hitting this morning
Re: Stamp Staying was: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #247360 by deniserows
Jul 3, 2008 12:11pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote How about glueing the stamp to the LOGBOOK.


Might work. Might also have the benefit of preventing finders from stamping into the box logbook using the box stamp. Am I the only one that gets this? You look through the log book and find several entries stamped with the box stamp. Duuuhhhh....

The first hybrid geocache/letterbox I found -- by using the GPS coordinates, there were no other clues available -- had a store-bought stamp of a frog in it. The log book had been stamped perhaps two dozen times with that frog. Mine was the first non-frog stamp image in the book. That's a couple of dozen people who think letterboxes are stupid.
Re: Stamp Staying was: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #247428 by Kirbert
Jul 3, 2008 1:40pm
Thread (disabled) Board
Quote That's a couple of dozen people who think letterboxes are stupid.


Not necessarily. I found a box several years ago in a overlook info sign — you know, the perment kind that's kind of slanted and tells about the area. The box had been slipped inside the sign. Even though no one would necessarily see it, (no one was supposed to walk near enough to the edge to look back at the sign) it had been found just a couple of days before me by someone, with lots of people there!

The box had a lavendar highlighter in it for a stamp pad and the stamp was a store bought Raggedy Ann type doll.

All these people thought they were supposed to stamp into it if they found it and they were writing down how great this was! They were tickled pink and had a great time!

Like you, I was the first to actually log into it with a different stamp. I don't know what the frog was like but when you see that same doll about 11 times in lavendar, it starts to look creepy and sci-fi like. . . <shudder>

KuKu
Re: Stamp Staying was: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #247428 by Kirbert
Jul 4, 2008 9:54am
Thread (disabled) Board
Am I the only one that gets this?

I think this happens with all the hybrids. Sometimes you'll get a geocacher with a sticker, but most times they don't get it. Once I met a 'cacher on the trail who said he had done some letterboxing and when I asked him if he wanted to do an exchange, he said he said he didn't carry his stamp or stamp-pad when geocaching.
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #248363 by Esmerelda
Jul 6, 2008 11:05am
Thread (disabled) Board
I got a message from the cacher this morning. She went back up the mountain yesterday and returned Olga's mule safely to the box. A boxer friend added another note about this not being the cache.

A happy ending! My favorite kind!


Shows how the right kind of communication (quick, friendly and making use of the AQ forums and geocaching site) can result in a returned stamp. Thanks for updating us on the happy ending. :)
Re: argh
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #248391 by Lone R
Jul 6, 2008 11:26am
Thread (disabled) Board
That's awesome Es - Congrats and thanks for the update.

Hope the cacher also got the cache she was looking for in the first place while back up there!

pre
Happy to have recently gotten that stamp in her logbook and glad to hear that others will be able to also - for years and years to come!
was argh/ now mistaken identity
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #246035 by Trailhead Tessie
Jul 10, 2008 8:25am
Thread (disabled) Board
This would probably be good, but the hobbies are not linked, except by 'boxers who 'cache and 'cachers who letterbox!
We just suffered _another_ case of mistaken identity.
Someone found our box and stocked it with trinkets and pieces of paper.
Our stamp and logbook gone.
I logged onto www.geocaching.com to look into this and it looks like the person that 'stocked' our box did not take the logbook and stamp.
I have asked the owners of the geocaches that share the area to please notify the seekers of our box, so that they do not mistake it for what they are seeking.
We have replaced this box and hope it will survive.
This is one of the older boxes in RI. It was originally planted by the Drew Clan and we adopted it when we started Letterboxing.
Diane
the von der Insels
Re: was argh/ now mistaken identity
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #250328 by von der Insel
Jul 10, 2008 8:26am
Thread (disabled) Board
which box?
Re: was argh/ now mistaken identity
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #250331 by BrewHiker
Jul 10, 2008 8:31am
Thread (disabled) Board
Island Sanctuary in Jamestown, RI.
We have also had problems with our box at the Conanicut Battery off Beavertail Rd.
Diane
the von der Insels
Re: was argh/ now mistaken identity
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #250332 by von der Insel
Jul 10, 2008 8:40am
Thread (disabled) Board
I wanted to get Island Sanctuary on our third-ever outing, but the kids had had enough.
We did get the Conanicut Cannon that day before the hike to Beavertail Light and Loss of a Friend.

Ah, the good ol' days...

*S
Re: was argh/ now mistaken identity
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #250336 by BrewHiker
Jul 10, 2008 8:48am
Thread (disabled) Board
Sorry we missed you -next time let us know you'll be in town. Who knows maybe there will be more boxs!
Diane
the von der Insels
Re: was argh/ now mistaken identity
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #250341 by von der Insel
Jul 10, 2008 8:51am
Thread (disabled) Board
LOL... that was almost four years ago! We did have an encounter on the trail, though we were clueless about exchanges. Who was it... Bicycle Bob and somebody else...

*S
Re: argh..Stamp returned!
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #248363 by Esmerelda
Jul 10, 2008 9:20am
Thread (disabled) Board
Awesome end to this story.
What a long thread, but I was able to navigate and hear your good news. what a blessing to know
their are conscientious LBers and GCers.

Guess I need to review all my boxes and CLEARLY mark that it is NOT a geocache and the stamp stays in the box.
Re: was argh/ now mistaken identity
Board: Geocaching and Other Stashing Games
Reply to: #250328 by von der Insel
Jul 10, 2008 10:39am
Thread (disabled) Board
Someone found our box and stocked it with trinkets and pieces of paper.
Our stamp and logbook gone.


I found a letterbox like that earlier this year, and my first thought was that geocachers had done it. But then I thought again, and no geocacher would take the logbook. Stamp, yes, logbook, no. I then checked the geocaching website, and there was only one geocache listed in the park, and no one had logged a find in over a year. So my conclusion was that some kids were having a party (it looked like a party spot), stumbled upon the letterbox in a drunken stupor, removed the logbook and stamp as a souvenir or whatever, and stuck their plastic party necklaces inside the box. Perhaps they had heard about geocache trades and thought it would be funny. The point being, if the logbook has been removed, it might be kids rather than geocachers doing it.