Read Messages
Re: Personal Traveler available June 7 & 8 in Portland
Board: State: Washington
Reply to: #232742 by mudflinginfools
Jun 1, 2008 12:25am
But mud, I will send you the image if you want. It's a special dispensation for my East coast friends, those I have met and those I "met" at the ice cream social.
HaPpY bIrThDaY! Again!
KuKu
HaPpY bIrThDaY! Again!
KuKu
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232832 by Kirbert
Jun 1, 2008 12:30am
mr. yuk said:
kirbert said
I know that when you said heathen, you were playing into the rhetoric or something. It's probably not your personal view. But I take umbrage with such an uncritical representation. It's one thing to deconstruct religions, but it's quite another to thing to call a whole group of people unenlightened or unprincipled, lacking a culture etc (a connotation of heathen) without specific explanation.
The tone of this debate has been serious and I think it's appropriate to keep it that way. :)
kirbert said
I know that when you said heathen, you were playing into the rhetoric or something. It's probably not your personal view. But I take umbrage with such an uncritical representation. It's one thing to deconstruct religions, but it's quite another to thing to call a whole group of people unenlightened or unprincipled, lacking a culture etc (a connotation of heathen) without specific explanation.
The tone of this debate has been serious and I think it's appropriate to keep it that way. :)
Personal Traveler available June 7 & 8
Board: State: Maine
Jun 1, 2008 12:31am
I have just posted a new PT, "Twenty Years of Dragonboats", http://www.atlasquest.com/boxes/showinfo.html?gBoxId=77774
It will be available if you come down and say hi to me at my booth at the dragonboat races in downtown Portland — that's Portland, OR.
Now, I created this PT because I like peeps to come down and see me — not a complicated reason!
However, I know my East coat friends can't come to THIS Portland. (Though somehow I am able to "be present" on the East coast!!!)
So, email me and let me know. Even better if you can find (on an older similar PT) my team's cheer and email it to me.
I will stamp and send to you if you send me your address. If you are coming to L&B, you can get it then instead, if you wish.
KuKu
It will be available if you come down and say hi to me at my booth at the dragonboat races in downtown Portland — that's Portland, OR.
Now, I created this PT because I like peeps to come down and see me — not a complicated reason!
However, I know my East coat friends can't come to THIS Portland. (Though somehow I am able to "be present" on the East coast!!!)
So, email me and let me know. Even better if you can find (on an older similar PT) my team's cheer and email it to me.
I will stamp and send to you if you send me your address. If you are coming to L&B, you can get it then instead, if you wish.
KuKu
Love the fish background
Board: Atlas Quest Announcements
Jun 1, 2008 12:48am
Whoa, isn't this fun? Sitting at work waiting for another group to finish their work, so I can do my validations; this should help me stay awake.
Re: Love the fish background
Board: Atlas Quest Announcements
Reply to: #232848 by prairie dog
Jun 1, 2008 12:55am
Ohhh I REALLY like this background!!!
Alaska HSM
Alaska HSM
Re: Love the fish background
Board: Atlas Quest Announcements
Reply to: #232849 by Alaska hsm
Jun 1, 2008 1:00am
isn't it cool when the octopus at the bottom reaches behind him and gets out those tiny barbells??
romana
romana
Re: Love the fish background
Board: Atlas Quest Announcements
Reply to: #232850 by Romana
Jun 1, 2008 1:04am
i like this theme...
where can i find it?
where can i find it?
Re: Love the fish background
Board: Atlas Quest Announcements
Reply to: #232850 by Romana
Jun 1, 2008 1:07am
I like the moving fish lips at the bottom right better. I've got plenty of time to wait and watch for it tonight.
Re: Love the fish background
Board: Atlas Quest Announcements
Reply to: #232852 by prairie dog
Jun 1, 2008 1:09am
her lips move all right, but when the octopus starts pumping the iron, her eyes bug out at his muscles... it's kinda cute.
romana
romana
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232843 by Green Tortuga
Jun 1, 2008 1:13am
I wonder where the CIA is counting mormons...in the 11.78% of "other" or somewhere in the 72.45% of un-accounted-for Christians (which is where they belong)
romana
Re: Nasty Log Notes/HH
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232491 by Eidolon
Jun 1, 2008 1:27am
Not always; once, I ran afoul of a new piece of state law, and when I asked about it, the guy said it hadn't, yet, been posted, but that ignorance of the law was no excuse.....I was at a loss to know where to begin my protest....Ever had one of those, "that's so ridiculous, I don't even know what to say," moments?
But I was kidding. About the "laws" of letterboxing.
We need an enforcement arm. kgb; kommitiet grazhdanin boxing. people keep disappearing.....
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232497 by Kirbert
Jun 1, 2008 2:14am
*sigh*...really tired of the debate....but we limp along.
There are lots of reasons for cultural bias. Part of that is religion, sure. But the way we communicate is substantially different, as well; so when we say "potato," they might hear, "I want to conquer your sister." Part of that is because we developed with substantial geographic separation, and in different environments. Like, in Japan, apparently making big motions is considered aggressive, where in Italy it's seen as a sign of passion and interest. The situation in many cases is ripe for misunderstanding.
It's one of those 'more than one way to open a can of soup' things. If you grow up in a separate place (kept apart by desert, mountains, or whatever), you tend to develop a different way of doing things. There's also the fact that one group of people who tend to do a lot of contacting new peoples is con artists; always looking for new victims. This can lead people to develop an insular attitude.
As far as why "everyone" is saying it, I've seen rumors based on nothing destroy reputation and ruin attitudes; if you're prone to be suspicious of outsiders, rumors like this are more likely to get started, and more likely to spread. And self-defense against the rumors is made more complicated by the culture issue; if I say something, it is more likely to be misunderstood. I might condemn myself in their eyes accidentally....like the time a reporter showed the bottom of his shoe to a Muslim leader; which is a sign of great disrespect.
Also, different environments can change attitudes. Difficult environments tend to polarize attitudes; either everyone is conservative about taking risks of trying new things (except for a few 'heroic' characters) because small errors can result in the death of the whole society, or everyone becomes obsessed with risk-taking, as strength is seen as the only way to defeat one's environment.
Lots of these things. Only a few being religious.
Maybe. I don't know. Differences in accepted methods can be a source of resentment.
Well, now, what emotional response is most rational depends on your definition of rational. A warlike society (polarized, you see, to see two types of obstacles: those not dealt with, and those destroyed) might find great joy in the destruction of an enemy. And, again, this attitude is more likely in an extreme environment; since any problem in these environments may mean death, extreme action may be the only one they're used to taking.
Well, now. You're talking about secretive organizations. Who knows where they are? Maybe they just see wealthy people, whom they consider enemies, and begin to associate "enemy" with "wealth." As a money target, it makes sense.
Or, maybe they are big believers in corporate responsibility. Since we vote, they may consider all of us part of the problem. I dunno. But these are possible answers.
Some racist people, no doubt, do. And if you're hating an enemy, it's not a smart bomb. There's collateral damage. "Those people" are the problem. "Over there" somewhere. Which of them? "Do you think I care enough about my enemy to differentiate between those who are directly assaulting me, and those who merely support them? Kill 'em all!" If you get my point.
Of course, not all of these people hate us. Some are moderate in response and belief about us; they don't appear to be in the majority. And problems with corruption of Iraqi politicians which we support exacerbate the problem....
I will grant that this is, partly, a religious issue. Most of their education does appear to be religious. Their poverty, of course, is not caused by their religion, it's caused by their politicians taking more money than their share....basic greed.
Of course, there are many things to study; understanding one's neighbors and enemies requires you to spend most of your time in studying current events, politics, and other similar topics. Even a well-educated populace which didn't study these things (which don't create a great deal of wealth, on their own) might have trouble accepting those with a different culture. And an insular society might view those who studied such things with suspicion, making their opinions less valued.
And sociology and politics encompass facts from which it is possible to draw multitudinous conclusions. Which can be filtered through one's own prejudices. Check out the many books on these topics which are mutually contradictory, in America, alone.
We are "other" because we're from "somewhere else." We are "other" because we have different ways of communicating feelings and intentions -- if I'm expecting something from you based on what you did, and you meant something different by it, I can use that as proof that you are deceitful. Or you might accidentally insult me.
We are also "other" for a bunch of other reasons; appearance, dress, military policy, and more. The Scots saw anyone who didn't charge into battle as a pansy. There're lots of things other than religion involved, there.
As far as Israel, sure, that's a big religious issue. But it's also a "war" issue. War and resentment and revenge are self-perpetuating. I'll not argue that religion is big in that one, though. As far as "forcing them" on the people of the area, that was a reward (which Balfour promised) for them mobilizing with the Allies in WWII.....there's a mix of things, there; religion, practicality, money, and so on. Religion, sure. But a lot more, too.
Heck, I think one of the reasons they're our allies is that, a.) they make at least an attempt at a stable political system (based upon more than despotism and corruption, though, they're far from perfect), and b.) they're one of the only ones in the region that doesn't decide, once every generation or two, to hate our guts. Oh...and c.) they don't accept political pressure to support those who like bombing airports, just to be left alone by those same nutcases.
Religion might be involved, there. But it's hard to forget that Syria supports those who do bombings; Saudi Arabia does, and so do most of the countries in the region. Whether or not they want to is another issue...for some, it might be blackmail...but it's still a reason to support someone who doesn't do it...even with their killing of locals...but I don't look for simple solutions to unsolvable problems. Random bombings do tend to make one overreact. They shot gramma, NUKE 'EM ALL! A common reaction, if you get my drift. Moderation is hard to value in both Iraq and Israel (and other places with shooting).
There are lots of reasons for cultural bias. Part of that is religion, sure. But the way we communicate is substantially different, as well; so when we say "potato," they might hear, "I want to conquer your sister." Part of that is because we developed with substantial geographic separation, and in different environments. Like, in Japan, apparently making big motions is considered aggressive, where in Italy it's seen as a sign of passion and interest. The situation in many cases is ripe for misunderstanding.
It's one of those 'more than one way to open a can of soup' things. If you grow up in a separate place (kept apart by desert, mountains, or whatever), you tend to develop a different way of doing things. There's also the fact that one group of people who tend to do a lot of contacting new peoples is con artists; always looking for new victims. This can lead people to develop an insular attitude.
As far as why "everyone" is saying it, I've seen rumors based on nothing destroy reputation and ruin attitudes; if you're prone to be suspicious of outsiders, rumors like this are more likely to get started, and more likely to spread. And self-defense against the rumors is made more complicated by the culture issue; if I say something, it is more likely to be misunderstood. I might condemn myself in their eyes accidentally....like the time a reporter showed the bottom of his shoe to a Muslim leader; which is a sign of great disrespect.
Also, different environments can change attitudes. Difficult environments tend to polarize attitudes; either everyone is conservative about taking risks of trying new things (except for a few 'heroic' characters) because small errors can result in the death of the whole society, or everyone becomes obsessed with risk-taking, as strength is seen as the only way to defeat one's environment.
Lots of these things. Only a few being religious.
Maybe. I don't know. Differences in accepted methods can be a source of resentment.
Well, now, what emotional response is most rational depends on your definition of rational. A warlike society (polarized, you see, to see two types of obstacles: those not dealt with, and those destroyed) might find great joy in the destruction of an enemy. And, again, this attitude is more likely in an extreme environment; since any problem in these environments may mean death, extreme action may be the only one they're used to taking.
Well, now. You're talking about secretive organizations. Who knows where they are? Maybe they just see wealthy people, whom they consider enemies, and begin to associate "enemy" with "wealth." As a money target, it makes sense.
Or, maybe they are big believers in corporate responsibility. Since we vote, they may consider all of us part of the problem. I dunno. But these are possible answers.
Some racist people, no doubt, do. And if you're hating an enemy, it's not a smart bomb. There's collateral damage. "Those people" are the problem. "Over there" somewhere. Which of them? "Do you think I care enough about my enemy to differentiate between those who are directly assaulting me, and those who merely support them? Kill 'em all!" If you get my point.
Of course, not all of these people hate us. Some are moderate in response and belief about us; they don't appear to be in the majority. And problems with corruption of Iraqi politicians which we support exacerbate the problem....
I will grant that this is, partly, a religious issue. Most of their education does appear to be religious. Their poverty, of course, is not caused by their religion, it's caused by their politicians taking more money than their share....basic greed.
Of course, there are many things to study; understanding one's neighbors and enemies requires you to spend most of your time in studying current events, politics, and other similar topics. Even a well-educated populace which didn't study these things (which don't create a great deal of wealth, on their own) might have trouble accepting those with a different culture. And an insular society might view those who studied such things with suspicion, making their opinions less valued.
And sociology and politics encompass facts from which it is possible to draw multitudinous conclusions. Which can be filtered through one's own prejudices. Check out the many books on these topics which are mutually contradictory, in America, alone.
We are "other" because we're from "somewhere else." We are "other" because we have different ways of communicating feelings and intentions -- if I'm expecting something from you based on what you did, and you meant something different by it, I can use that as proof that you are deceitful. Or you might accidentally insult me.
We are also "other" for a bunch of other reasons; appearance, dress, military policy, and more. The Scots saw anyone who didn't charge into battle as a pansy. There're lots of things other than religion involved, there.
As far as Israel, sure, that's a big religious issue. But it's also a "war" issue. War and resentment and revenge are self-perpetuating. I'll not argue that religion is big in that one, though. As far as "forcing them" on the people of the area, that was a reward (which Balfour promised) for them mobilizing with the Allies in WWII.....there's a mix of things, there; religion, practicality, money, and so on. Religion, sure. But a lot more, too.
Heck, I think one of the reasons they're our allies is that, a.) they make at least an attempt at a stable political system (based upon more than despotism and corruption, though, they're far from perfect), and b.) they're one of the only ones in the region that doesn't decide, once every generation or two, to hate our guts. Oh...and c.) they don't accept political pressure to support those who like bombing airports, just to be left alone by those same nutcases.
Religion might be involved, there. But it's hard to forget that Syria supports those who do bombings; Saudi Arabia does, and so do most of the countries in the region. Whether or not they want to is another issue...for some, it might be blackmail...but it's still a reason to support someone who doesn't do it...even with their killing of locals...but I don't look for simple solutions to unsolvable problems. Random bombings do tend to make one overreact. They shot gramma, NUKE 'EM ALL! A common reaction, if you get my drift. Moderation is hard to value in both Iraq and Israel (and other places with shooting).
Re: Nasty Log Notes/HH
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232501 by Baqash
Jun 1, 2008 2:16am
Man, that sucks....sorry to hear it. But you lived...and that's good.
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232502 by Kirbert
Jun 1, 2008 2:18am
Hmm....that begs the question, is such a spiritual need still helpful to man's survival? I mean, obviously we're experiencing some trouble with religion, but might it also be necessary? Again, dunno.
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232507 by Kayak Bandit
Jun 1, 2008 2:24am
I'll agree with Kay Ban, here. It does appear that Kirbirt is outnumbered by people who disagree with him, but then, that's not something we did on purpose. And as far as ganging, hmmm...do you mean we're being mean by disagreeing? I'm not sure what you mean by that.
We're not being intentionally rude or mean, if that helps.
And thanks for the support, kb....although I'm terrible at taking compliments, I appreciate the support. Now, all i need is your credit card....:) heh heh....
And, lest I get too big a head, I have TONS of flaws, so, let's not make more of me than is appropriate....worst case, I might believe ya.
Re: Nasty Log Notes/HH
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232516 by Kirbert
Jun 1, 2008 2:26am
Uh....outlaw potholes, and only outlaws will have potholes?
hey, with enough tickets, you might fill the pothole....
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232559 by Kirbert
Jun 1, 2008 2:30am
Well, now; that's a heck of an assumption. Knowing that, for sure, requires both omniscience and telepathy.
In which case, do you have the next Derby winners?
Perhaps people have subjective or experiential reasons for believing in a deity. Perhaps, in the absence of "primary evidence" (directly supporting the belief), they make do with "secondary evidence" (circumstantial, perhaps, or things that might imply the existence of the supernatural, or whatever).
Re: Displaying Periodic Table LTCs
Board: LTC: Trades and Trackers
Reply to: #232807 by Boxer Lover47
Jun 1, 2008 2:50am
We are taking them to our high school and hanging them in the Chemistry room... the teacher there is a good friend. She was my teacher, she is now my daughters.
mff
mff
Re: 3rd Annual International Letterbox Planting Day
Board: State: Massachusetts
Reply to: #232765 by zess the treehuggers
Jun 1, 2008 2:53am
You have no idea... and its all because of my teenagers Mother's day present! LOL!
mud
mud
Stick a Fork in Them
Board: Sports Emporium
Jun 1, 2008 3:12am
The Penguins are done. Stick a fork in them. The CUP is headed back to Detroit.
Re: Nasty Log Notes/HH
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232590 by recycledpaperbags
Jun 1, 2008 3:15am
Arrows and crossbow bolts and slingstones...basically, any ranged weapon can help a weak man against a stronger man. The gun doesn't require any strength to use (though the crossbow requires less than the bow, and the slingstone requires the most accuracy, the longest prep, and the least strength [long moment arm]).
the gun, however, requires less paranoia on the part of the user, since it is fast....
As far as not needing them, well, it depends on what you mean. People have died from strong people for thousands of years...a gun might have kept them alive....but if you consider staying alive not a need...
Re: Nasty Log Notes/HH
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232593 by DoubleSaj and Old Blue
Jun 1, 2008 3:18am
Wanna hear something REALLY weird? I had a lesbian friend (and too bad, too; she was cute and I would'a asked her out) who kept using the word "gay" as a pejorative.....and gave me a mental jar every time she did it.
"Oh, that is so gay."
Me: *wobble* ....uh...what?
Re: Nasty Log Notes/HH
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232597 by DoubleSaj and Old Blue
Jun 1, 2008 3:19am
*snort*....I'm guessing you don't live in Compton.
Re: Displaying Periodic Table LTCs
Board: LTC: Trades and Trackers
Reply to: #232864 by mudflinginfools
Jun 1, 2008 3:22am
I haven't decided how to display them, but I'm doing some serious thinking about it. I have a wall in my living room...... our "decor" is eclectic at best (to put it politely), so I've just started putting up stuff I like and to heck with everything else ;-))
I'm wondering if a poster frame will fit them - something where I can access the back to arrange them like the periodic table. Guess I need to lay 100 cards out on the bed or something to get an idea ;-))
I like that spinner thingy on that 7 gypsies site, but they are rather proud of it. I could probably stand the price of the spinner, but it would be another $30 or so for the little plasticy things. Wondering if those are standard Rolodex size.... oh, I guess that's what that punch thing is for.........
Well, I still like the idea of putting them on the wall. I know my comic book store guy has these poster frames that he gets from Ultrapro, that's a possibility.
I'm talking to myself - woke up early and couldn't go back to sleep, darn it.....
Mama Fox
I'm wondering if a poster frame will fit them - something where I can access the back to arrange them like the periodic table. Guess I need to lay 100 cards out on the bed or something to get an idea ;-))
I like that spinner thingy on that 7 gypsies site, but they are rather proud of it. I could probably stand the price of the spinner, but it would be another $30 or so for the little plasticy things. Wondering if those are standard Rolodex size.... oh, I guess that's what that punch thing is for.........
Well, I still like the idea of putting them on the wall. I know my comic book store guy has these poster frames that he gets from Ultrapro, that's a possibility.
I'm talking to myself - woke up early and couldn't go back to sleep, darn it.....
Mama Fox
Re: My first!
Board: Hitchhikers, Cooties, and Fleas
Reply to: #232311 by vee-dub bug
Jun 1, 2008 3:37am
Congrats!
My wife and I are very new to this game (letterboxing now for all of 20 days) and we just found our first HH yesterday! It was so cool to find a "bonus" inside another box. I hope your HH travels far and wide and you are able to track it journeys.
Opening the box
reveals a delightful gift
hitchhiker inside!
haiku4u
How do we keep this as our permanent background?
Board: Letterboxing Help Desk
Jun 1, 2008 3:52am
Is there any way we can keep this fish background as our permanent background??
~BOB~
~BOB~
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232620 by Kirbert
Jun 1, 2008 3:54am
Well, actually, a number of problems with Darwin's theory; even most evolutionists agree that evolution, if true, is different than Darwin imagined. There are too many problems with the fossil record, and with intermediate states, and with the actual observed occurence of new species without influence of breeding or survival of fittest.
As far as Creation vs. Evolution, comparison of the Gospels with Genesis shows that they aren't necessarily in any conflict, except to state that God was responsible for what DID happen. Luke remarks that his recounting is important, in that it is chronological (in order) which implies that old Hebrew writings may have jumped around a bit....which would explain the variations in the gospels (if they were written topically), and would make a much more interesting reading of Genesis....if the Bible implies that things may not, always, have included all details, and may be jumping around, timewise, I have to figure it's a guideline, contained IN the text, for READING the text....
Evolution theory, as it stands, is incomplete; Creation theory, as it stands, is poorly written and researched. I think they're both junk science; people want to defend their positions, and so reach conclusions pre-emptively, and before the science part has been completed....
Besides; the theist - antitheist debate is really looking into infinity and guessing what lies beyond it...what Christians dislike is the arrogance of the scientific community in saying "This is fact" in a time that the "fact" is still being tested; the tendency to draw conclusions and state them as fact, rather than theory (two points in a straight line could mean a line, a ray, a segment, a sinewave, or a Ford Taurus), the tendency to equate science with antitheism (when you can't prove God one way or the other; Christians who claim science proves God annoy me), and their own lack of questioning something that seems to prove their pet theory (especially if they believe that it disproves God). Scientists need to remember how to say, "We THINK this is what this means."
I hate the whole argument; people spend so much time defending their trenches, that the other (non-religion-debate-related), more important implications of findings are ignored. And the tendency to hypnotize on the debate keeps us from doing the intermediate, and non-associated science.
It is always necessary to question science; destructive testing (much as I'd hate it, if it was MY finding) keeps us from going more wacko than we already do.
Re: Field Trips and penguin boxes
Board: State: Ohio
Reply to: #232794 by Mama Stork
Jun 1, 2008 4:21am
Hi,
I am now truly sorry that I was such a wimp about Cowabunga!!! Oh well....
PP's boxes and logbooks are amazing and I will miss them. But I have found most of her's in Louisville.
As for the Queen City; I have found almost all of them and now have to venture farther and farther from home. But I do look each day for new plants and do notice some new people in the area. And some are planted on the west side of town!! For those of you who know Cincinnatian's and know that if I live on the East side what that means!!!!!! I have to venture into unknown territory....
Today, the exHarley guy and I will be moving Lindsay of Lindsay's Snowman fame from her dorm into an apartment. And it is her 20th BD today. I am really afraid for what we will find, worry about whether this apartment that we have not seen will be big enough for all of her stuff ( and that she is sharing with two other roommates, but one has sublet it for the summer to two guys and there is one bathroom) and how the apartment will have been left since the previous occupants moved out YESTERDAY!!!!! Oh does this bring back the memories.
I hope that all of you enjoy the Greenville event; I am sorry to miss it.
LS
I am now truly sorry that I was such a wimp about Cowabunga!!! Oh well....
PP's boxes and logbooks are amazing and I will miss them. But I have found most of her's in Louisville.
As for the Queen City; I have found almost all of them and now have to venture farther and farther from home. But I do look each day for new plants and do notice some new people in the area. And some are planted on the west side of town!! For those of you who know Cincinnatian's and know that if I live on the East side what that means!!!!!! I have to venture into unknown territory....
Today, the exHarley guy and I will be moving Lindsay of Lindsay's Snowman fame from her dorm into an apartment. And it is her 20th BD today. I am really afraid for what we will find, worry about whether this apartment that we have not seen will be big enough for all of her stuff ( and that she is sharing with two other roommates, but one has sublet it for the summer to two guys and there is one bathroom) and how the apartment will have been left since the previous occupants moved out YESTERDAY!!!!! Oh does this bring back the memories.
I hope that all of you enjoy the Greenville event; I am sorry to miss it.
LS
Re: free to say what you want in a LB or HH?????
Board: Dead Horses, Lemurs, and Kittens!
Reply to: #232676 by Mr Yuk
Jun 1, 2008 4:28am
Well, actually, I did some soul-searching about this, and I came to some rather difficult conclusions. As in, difficult to bear.
First, God gives us an ability to choose. That is a hard thing. If he is to have people with whom he has a relationship, they have to be non-puppets. Socializing with puppets is unsatisfying, for anyone over the age of 12.
Second, if God keeps us from USING the ability to choose, we simply have a more complicated puppet relationship with him. And he's basically given us a self-defeating trait.
If we are immediately punished for doing bad, but rewarded for doing good, how can he, as the judge of the living, prove whether we are doing good because we're greedy, or because we are 'of goodwill?'
Why is he the judge of the living? One: he made us, so he has authority granted by that. Two: he has more power than anyone, so he has the ability to enforce. Three: he was here first, so any precedence of law is in his favor. Four: He is omniscient, so only he has the necessary perspective to judge justly. Five: ultimately, there is no further "up" people can go, when they make their complaints about what is injust.
That's one reason that he does, sometimes, interfere with human history. As the Bible says, "and their cry came up unto God..." But there are a number of reasons he doesn't do it, much. One, it creates great suffering. Think about Pharaoh's armies; those men died in the Red (or Reed) Sea; what happened to their families? The plagues also gave suffering. So he seems to save it for times when it is the last of the last choices.
Two, if he interferes, too much, again we are puppets. He must give us, to judge, "enough rope to hang ourselves." And if he makes it too obvious that only good will succeed, you'll end up with folks parroting good to hide their bad. We already have that with politicians.
That's one of the reasons we're supposed to be "the hands of Christ." Since God keeps himself in certain behaviors to preserve his role as judge and to preserve our ability to choose, WE are supposed to be the ones who fix all this stuff, since we are not limited by being affected by the ethical requirements of being the judge of the universe. This suffering is on US, not God.
There's more, but this is the key issue, for me. And, I know, many atheists will pooh-pooh this argument, because they do not believe that a cosmic judge is NECESSARY. As someone who has seen some of the evil that people do, I really feel that a cosmic judge IS necessary. Not out of vindictiveness, but sheer necessity.
Re: Love the fish background
Board: Atlas Quest Announcements
Reply to: #232848 by prairie dog
Jun 1, 2008 4:30am
oh, i love this. have to run and check to sea........if it is one of our picks for preferences :J
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